Mars Hill Church – Page 75 – Warren Throckmorton

Mark Driscoll in 2000: “We Live in a Completely Pussified Nation”

I have been writing about Mars Hill Church since late November 2013. In the process, I have met many people who once attended Mars and some who still do (over 100 I think). In these conversations, especially with ex-members who were around from the early days, similar stories come up. One familiar story I have not written about is Mark Driscoll’s proclamation that we “live in a completely pussified nation.” Apparently this material was deleted from the Mars Hill website and is not now available anywhere. According to my sources, some Mars Hill pastors have asked former members to destroy any copies of the thread they had printed out. It has now become available again and I think it may be of some benefit to understand the historical development of Mars Hill Church and the controversies surrounding Mark Driscoll’s preaching and commentary on gender.

In 2006, Driscoll commented favorably on his William Wallace II remarks in his book Confessions of a Reformission Rev (see below). To my knowledge, he has not refuted or distanced himself from these sentiments since then. I do offer the observation that the thread is 14 years old and may not represent how he would communicate to his church today.

The image below is of the first paragraph of what turned out to be a thread of over 100 pages of material on the Mars Hill Church unmoderated forum called Midrash.

To read some history behind Midrash and this thread go to Wenatchee the Hatchet’s site.

Driscoll referred to this thread and his alias as William Wallace II in his 2006 book Confessions of a Reformission Rev:

So because Driscoll believed the men in his church were soft and feminine, he attacked them anonymously. His opening salvo as William Wallace II, while clever in its machismo, was quickly challenged by another person who wondered if Jesus was pussified. Driscoll, as you will see if you read the whole thing, dismissed the poster’s concerns. In the excerpts below,

Driscoll belittled those who disagreed with him.

To read the entire 100+ page thread, go here.

Driscoll echos the mom-bashers of the WWII and post-war era. Philip Wylie (“momism“) and Ed Strecker are two I have written about previously. The jacket cover of Strecker’s 1946 book, Their Mothers’ Sons, proclaimed:

This is a book about Mother, the great American “Mom,” and what she is doing to the young men of America. In its pages a world-famous psychiatrist describes in unforgettable terms a new American tragedy – the millions of young men in this country today who live in confusion and emotional chaos, condemned by millions of well-meaning and unthinking “Moms” who will not cut the apron strings between them and their sons.

Strecker, a military psychiatrist, believed that doting mothers were often at fault when their soldier sons developed psychiatric disorders. Both Wylie and Strecker thought men of the day were unable to achieve maturity because mothers prevented their full development. Driscoll would have been right at home with Wylie and Strecker, proud members of the “He Man Woman Haters Club.”

For the sake of context, here is the entire first post from Driscoll:

More excerpts:

Mars Hill Church Spokesman Touts Result Source Aided Real Marriage NYT Bestseller Campaign as Accomplishment

In his bio at a website called “Innovate4Jesus,” Mars Hill Church Spokesman Justin Dean touts his experience helping to get Mark Driscoll’s book Real Marriage to #1 on the New York Times Bestseller List:

On the Innovate4Jesus website, “#1 New York Time Bestseller” links to the January 22, 2012 NYT list for “Hard Cover Advice” books on which the Driscolls’ book Real Marriage placed at #1 for one week. See below for the text copied as it is now on the I4J website.

ABOUT JUSTIN DEAN

With over thirteen years of experience, Justin has been recognized as an innovative, entrepreneurial, results-focused leader in the marketing, advertising and public relations industry. He has held senior management roles for some of the most revolutionary start-ups, as well as larger organizations such as Cox Enterprises, Home Depot Supply, and Autotrader.com.

Marketing projects led by Justin include several best-selling books including a #1 New York Times Bestseller, award winning advertising campaigns, and web tools used by millions of users every day.

Justin currently leads the communications and social media teams for one of the largest, fastest-growing, and most innovative churches in the country. He enjoys technology, design and connecting people to new things. You can find him in Seattle, WA where he lives with his wife and three kids.

Connect with Justin at justindean.com, on Twitter, Facebook, LinkedIn or email him.

In a tweet earlier this afternoon, Becky Garrison asked Mr. Dean to elaborate on his role in the marketing campaign. I am also curious about how Mars Hill staff (was it just Mr. Dean or were others involved?) were included in the marketing campaign. The relevance here is that paid church staff were apparently involved in promoting the Real Marriage campaign. As has been widely reported (e.g., here and here), Mars Hill Church contracted with Result Source to purchase books valued at over $200,000. In the contract with Mars Hill Church, Result Source guaranteed that their method of gaming the New York Times Bestseller list would result in Real Marriage hitting #1 on the Bestseller list or else the additional $25,000 fee would be refunded.

Dean’s bio raises questions about who actually implemented the campaign. Dean seems to imply in his bio that he was in charge. I am also curious about how much time paid Mars Hill staff put into assisting Result Source or in other ways helped get Driscolls’ book to the status guaranteed by the contract. If staff assisted in gathering names and addresses for use by Result Source, or assisted in other functions related to the campaign, then it is likely that the real cost of the Real Marriage campaign greatly exceeded the $210,000-250,000 figures frequently reported and which are based simply on the Result Source contract.

Dean may have been involved in other ways such as developing ads or promotional material and those materials may have been very good. However, since it is now known that the Result Source campaign guaranteed #1 status, taking credit for the result seems to be a hollow accomplishment to tout.

After the many mixed signals Mars Hill Church has sent about the Result Source-Real Marriage campaign, it is surprising that anyone associated with Mars Hill Church leadership would extol it.

Ex-Mars Hill Group Plans Demonstration at the Church on August 3

Calling it a “We Are Not Anonymous Protest,” a group of ex-Mars Hill members plans to assemble outside of Mars Hill Church next Sunday. Created by Rob Smith, the event is intended to respond to Mark Driscoll’s claim that many ex-Mars Hill members have been complaining anonymously. Recently, a Facebook group dedicated to countering Driscoll’s claim has grown to over 400 members.
The group has launched a crowdfunding page at GoFundMe.com with the following description:

This campaign is to be able to purchase placards, moving billboards and other expenses related to a peaceful protest on Sunday, August 3rd. Any monies left over will go to Bent Meyer and Paul Petry as a beginning token of affection to them and the first fruits of restitution for the ordeal that they were put through in 2007.

Given the statements of Mark Driscoll that he wants reconciliation, it is astounding that Mars Hill leaders have not reached out to Petry and Meyer.

One Day, Two Views of Mars Hill Church

Yesterday, the Seattle Post-Intelligencer and World magazine posted articles about Mars Hill Church. To me, the articles do not seem to be about the same church.

The Seattle PI piece addressed the newest development among former Mars Hill Church members and leaders: the Facebook group which alerts the public that many ex-Mars Hill members are not and have not been anonymous in their complaints about the church. Mark Driscoll claimed in a speech to the church just over a week ago that leaders at the church could not reconcile with ex-members because they were anonymous. The Facebook group now has over 260 member and features many very visible ex-members and their stories.

The World article painted a much nicer picture of the church, failing to include voices of ex-members or evidence to counter the favorable comments of Mars Hill Public Relation deacon, Justin Dean, or the Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability which apparently is not going to require adherence to the organization’s guidelines. Surprising to me was the lack of challenge from World to this explanation of Mars Hill Global from the church:

However, it is difficult to determine where the money went, though it is now clear some of the money went not to international efforts but to domestic church plants, including some in the Seattle area. When WORLD asked via email for an itemized accounting of those funds, Dean wrote, “Since donations given by the Mars Hill Global family were never intended to be designated solely for international efforts, we don’t provide an itemized accounting of those funds.”

“Some of the money”? The church has already admitted that the preponderance of donations when to domestic church plants. Justin Dean’s statement is a dodge of World’s question which went unchallenged. There is plenty of evidence that Mars Hill created a Global Fund in 2012. Members and pastors of the church alike were under the impression those donations were being solicited for international missions. In spite of all the evidence that after 2012 the Global Fund was pitched as a ministry of Mars Hill Church to support international missions (not a group of non-members), Mars Hill spun the situation with no challenge from World. There was no mention of the fact that Mars Hill has issued two takedown orders to You Tube to keep video evidence about Mars Hill Global out of the public view.

At last, the Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability speaks. However, even this group ignores the clear evidence. Worse yet, apparently ECFA will not require the church to reveal how much they spent on international missions and how much was spent on domestic efforts.

Finally, I have no problem with the interviews of current pastors at Mars Hill, but to then give ex-pastor Dave Kraft only a brief blurb at the end was not nearly enough to report on the level of distress and conflict there is currently among former members (Mars Hill in exile). Usually World is more balanced and demonstrates a better ability to investigate the crux of a matter. I hope World will revisit this issue and report on the extraordinary distress that is taking place daily among those who want to see reform at the Seattle megachurch.

New Group to Mark Driscoll and Mars Hill Church: We Are Not Anonymous

In his video address to Mars Hill Church, lead pastor Mark Driscoll to the congregation that the leaders of Mars Hill were having some difficulty knowing how to response to the latest crisis because many of those raising concerns about the church were doing so anonymously. Driscoll said:

As well, one of the things that has been… complex is the fact that a lot of the people that we are dealing with in this season remain anonymous. And so we don’t know how to reconcile, or how to work things out with, with people because we’re not entirely sure who they are, and so that has, that has made things a little more complex and difficult as well.

I suspect there are some Mars Hill critics who remain anonymous to Mars Hill’s leaders. On the other hand, there are numerous people who have left Mars Hill and who are leaving Mars Hill who have made their concern known by name. I interviewed one such person in a prior post and now a new group on Facebook has been formed to address Driscoll’s claims. Titled, Dear Pastor Mark & Mars Hill: We Are Not Anonymous, the community group page now has nearly 100 likes after being formed late yesterday.
UPDATE: The group has become an open group on Facebook and can be viewed here.