UPDATE: 10/4/07
Since I entered this post regarding the International Healing Foundation, I have been contacted by Hilde Wiemann with explanations offered for the information I posted below. I also have spoken with her by phone. She told me that most of what I wrote below was incorrect about her and the IHF. In the spirit of fairness and openness, I am adding her explanations at the beginning of this post for the benefit of any new readers who come here. You will read her statements first and then you can consult the body of this post. In the final analysis, readers who are interested in this will review our exchange and the linked websites and come to their own conclusions. In the midst of her comments, I will intersperse some observations.
First off, Mrs. Wiemann felt that my question regarding IHF being a Christian organization was misplaced. She said it is a non-profit educational foundation and not intended to be viewed as a Christian organization. She wrote: “IHF was established in 1990 as a therapeutic and educational foundation to assist those with unwanted same-sex attraction and their loved ones. It was not founded as a religious organization.”
She also told me that she converted to Christianity in 1995 and left the UC along with Cohen.
She continued by noting my comments from the original post below and then providing her response:
Here are more clarifications regarding all incorrect statements in your piece:
1. “After review of the IHF website, one thing that can be said for the organization is that many religions are represented by his staff…:
All IHF staff members are Christian: Richard Cohen, Becca Kellner, and Hilde Wiemann.
2. “A brief review finds professionals operating from within Latter Day Saint, Jewish, Christian and Unification Church traditions.”
No one on our referral list is associated with the Unification Church.
3. “However, in 1997, Cohen incorporated the IHF in Washington state with two Unification Church members (Victoria Clevenger and Hilde Wiemann) on the board.”
IHF was incorporated in 1990. No Unification Church persons were founding members. According to Richard, this was an independent project of his own which had nothing to do with the UC.
I did err in reporting the 1997 annual report as being the incorporation paper. I corrected this below. Mrs. Wiemann is correct that the IHF was incorporated in 1990. I now have a copy of the incorporation papers supplied by a former board member. As listed, the three founding directors were Richard Cohen, Betsy Jones, and Nora Spurgin. Click the links to review a website regarding the people involved. This does not confirm that the IHF was a project of the UC but these websites identify the people as UC members at that time.
4. “Cohen is listed as President and Vice President, his wife Jae Sook Cohen as Treasurer and Hilde Wiemann as Secretary.”
Richard Cohen is President, Arthur Goldberg is Vice President, and Jae Sook Cohen is Secretary-Treasurer (2007).
The IRS Form 990 for 2006 lists Mrs. Wiemann as treasurer. Mrs. Wiemann told me this was a mistake of the IHF accountant to list her and that she is not now on the board.
5. “Hilde Wiemann, an associate since his Unification Church days, continues to serve as Secretary for the board.”
I have not been an officer or on the IHF board members since 2002.
6. “Mrs. Wiemann is also listed by the Blessed Family Department of the UC as the national co-director of Coaching Ministries for the Unification Church.”
I have never been in such a position with that church. Furthermore, I repeatedly requested that they remove any reference to myself from their websites.
As noted below, her name is listed here and here (click the link Download a list of ministries) as having this volunteer role. If this is a mistake, it is an honest one on my part. Mrs. Wiemann told me she left the UC in 1995. The references to her on UC websites are here, here, here, here, and here.
7. “It is inconceivable that he is unaware of this connection, since he dedicated his book on family healing to Mr. & Mrs. Wiemann and she was one of the incoporating board members of his organization.”
Warren, your words are misleading. Mr. Cohen dedicated his book first and formost to God, second to his family, and finally to many of his friends. You make it sound as though he only dedicated it to my husband and myself. Please correct this. And as previously stated, I was never one of the incoporating members of IHF.
I agree that some readers might get the impression that the book was dedicated only to the Wiemanns. As she notes, there are multiple dedications.
Now, some of what I corrected and noted here are details that have little impact on the basic point of the post. My initial comments were in response to requests for information from my readers and those who seek sexual identity services. I trust this exchange will provide that information for those seeking it. In short, Mrs. Wiemann says there are no Unification Church connections, and that she and Mr. Cohen both converted to Christianity in 1995. She says that the references to her on Unification websites are based on occasional work in coaching she was hired to do by the Unification Church. She says the websites do not properly represent her and she has and will continue to ask the webmasters of these sites to change how she is represented on these sites. Indeed, she thanked me for bringing these references to her attention.
To view the original post, continue reading and come to your own conclusions…
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Beginning of original post dated 10-3-07
Recently, a reader wrote to ask what I thought of Richard Cohen’s International Healing Foundation (IHF) as a source of Christian assistance for someone who wished sexual reorientation. I indicated that do not endorse the techniques demonstrated by Mr. Cohen, nor do I believe his views of same-sex attraction to be an accurate representation of the research. While my opinions were of interest to the reader, the questioner was specifically looking for help within an evangelical Christian framework. I knew Mr. Cohen said he had converted to Christianity, but I was not sure about a specific religious orientation at IHF.
After a review of the IHF website, one thing that can be said for the organization is that many religions are represented by his staff, those on his list of referral therapists and “certified sexual reorientation coaches.” A brief review finds professionals operating from within Latter Day Saint, Jewish, Christian and Unification Churchtraditions. The latter group, followers of Sun Myung Moon, is surprising since Cohen said he left that church behind in 1995. Curious, I asked Cohen recently by email if there were any of his staff had connections to the UC, and he told me, to his knowledge, there were none. To the contrary, it appears that there has been involvement in the church for quite some time by at least Mrs. Wiemann.
It is old news that Cohen spent 20 years in the UC. He told me recently in an email that he left that church in 1995. However, in 1997, Cohen incorporated the IHF in Washington state with two Unification Church members (Victoria Clevengerand Hilde Wiemann) on the board. (See correction below). On 1997 annual report, Cohen is listed as President and Vice President, his wife Jae Sook Cohen as Treasurer and Hilde Wiemann as Secretary. Hilde Wiemann, an associate since his Unification Church days, continues to serve as Secretary of the IHF board. She is also the Assistant Director of the Foundation, has served as Public Relations Director and is the lead parent trainer for the IHF teleconference classes.
Mrs. Wiemann is also listed by the Blessed Family Department of the UC as the national co-director of Coaching Ministries for the Unification Church.
As noted, Cohen either does want these apparent connections to the Unification Church known or he genuinely does not know. It is very difficult to see how he could unaware of this connection, since the Wiemanns were two people, among several, to whom he dedicated his book on family healing and she has been an associate since his UC days. It is reasonable to ask, why not be open about this? If Mr. Cohen is running a multi-faith agency, then it would serve informed consent to alert potential clients of this fact. Earlier this week, I sent an email asking him this question, and it was returned with this message:
ihf90 IS NOT ACCEPTING MAIL FROM THIS SENDER
These questions regarding IHF are especially relevant in light of the imminent publication of Gay Children, Straight Parents by Christian publisher, Intervarsity Press. Already available through Christian booksellers, it is reasonable to assume his readers will think his perspective is evangelical Christian. Furthermore, in the book, he frequently invokes God as being involved in the healing process (31 times in the Introduction). He also refers readers to his healing seminars, and parent teleconference sessions, where they may become clients of professionals of a variety of religious backgrounds, including those many evangelicals consider to be a cult.
My purpose here is not to criticize the religious views of Mr. Cohen or his associates. In principle, it is proper for Christians to seek help from people from other religions, and I believe it is proper to pursue certain common goals with people of various faiths. However, evangelicals are understandably wary of cults who alter orthodox teaching but appear to be evangelical. More practically, some people want assistance in line with their faith. Mr. Cohen’s new book will be released in the evangelical market, sold in Christian bookstores, and is endorsed by leading figures in the Christian right (e.g., Joseph Nicolosi, Regina Griggs, Janelle Hallman). It is reasonable to think that this context may create confusion about what IHF has to offer. This may be especially true if Mr. Cohen is not forthcoming regarding his associates. Parents, such as my email questioner, who consult this book, looking for guidance from orthodox Christians will need to take extra care to sort through the recommended resources, especially Mr. Cohen’s own organization.
CORRECTION: I reported above that Mr. Cohen incorporated the IHF in 1997. This is incorrect. According to the 1997 nonprofit corporation annual report I have, the IHF was first incorporated in Washington state on 9-10-1990. I do not have the original incorporation papers to know who was the original board. However, in 1997, Victoria Clevenger was the registered agent and Hilde Wiemann was the Secretary for IHF.
UPDATE 10-12-07: More information is provided here regarding websites that have been altered in recent days to remove or alter references to Mrs. Wiemann. If there are links above that do not work or seem relevant, it may be that they have been altered. Feel free to note those in the comments section.
Also, see this page for a summary of information.
I am a fan of your Throckmorton. I really appeciate the effort you put into making complex science clear and understable, providing the facts as we know them and not promoting propaganda or sensationalism.
I also appreciate the fact that you don’t fear dissenting. When someone prints inaccurate information, this should be quickly clarified. All exgay organizations should do the same in a respectful and constructive way. It is also important that people not lump all exgay organizations together since there are clearly differences on almost every level except taht some can and do change.
If in fact the exgay movement has matured, it is important taht we do not regress –giving unnecessary basis for criticism–thus distracting from our aim and true focus.
However, I agree with Jim Phelan. I questioned the whole time while reading this… ‘and the relevance?’ WHen he finally spoke, he took the words out of my mouth.
Every nit picky truth need not be brought to light. Every obsure fact doesn’t need to be made a spectical. In my humble opinion, I do apology if im wrong, but it does appear that you will, to no end, do whatever it takes to discredit RC–religion included– if it would cause him to give up or cause this audience to disappear.
It is true as some have stated taht some parents will do anythign they can to “save” their children no matter the means, but the other side is that most parents are more sensible. Evangelicals in particular will distance themselves from RC because of such references. Some parents might believe that they will get the ‘UC bug’ just by reading his books.
I don’t think the Unification Church is a basis for criticism. If he is no longer a member, he is no longer a member. If he thinks that it provides a network he is comfortable affiliating with at some level, that is his business. He can clarify the relationship as he has. People can accept it or not. I can reject a religion but still see it as providing some good. I disagree with Catholic idols and other controversies, but that doesn’t mean that i will not participate in some Catholic function–especially SportsCamp. that is not hypocritical. They provide a service i can use and benefit from and i do so to the extent that i can and go no further than that.
RC has been a valuable contribution for me. One of the first books i read some four years ago was Reparative Therapy for Male Homosexuality by J. Nicolosi. It was a valuable book. It explain many ways in which my SSA may have developed. Since i had already developed a theory of my own before reading this material, i was able to expand what i already believed to be true. I found many other subtleties that are symptoms of my SSA that i would not have otherwise attributed to SSA.
The other book that was very meaninful to me was Battle for Normality. I didn’t agree with everything that was said and it was hard to understand at times but it was still a valuable resource. I learned terms and concepts to describe feeligns i have yet to find in other books.
After reading these two books, i was extremely frustrated!!! I had gain all this knowledge about my own SSA to the extent that it applied to me, but i had NO WAY OF RESOLVING ANYTHING! I understood the problem, but didn’t know how to fix it. I was frustrated. I hated Nicolosi because he had this book. I felt that he could have give us more information on POSSIBLE SOLUTIONS but instead i felt he just wanted to give us only enough to make us take therapy! He kept all the solutions to himself so he can make money leaving us begging for any small crumbs a therapist might give.
RC was not like that. With all these books, i took what was valuable adn put the rest aside. Even if something is completely conventional, it doesn’t make it right. Conventional wisdom is that Change is not possible. It is not true. Just because a body of people accept something to be accurate doesn’t mean it is. With RC, i did just what i did with the others, took what i felt was of value and left the rest.
RC changed my life! He gave me techniques that othes did not give. I didn’t practice his techniques like some biblical text, but the principles behind them helped me to see how i can come up with my own solutions to problems i was having and because of learning how to find alternative ways to express my unmet emotional needs, i’ve made great progress. I haven’t had to rely on some expensive therapist to point the way. I can read a book, get a little insight and ponder solutions. Sometimes i ask what has helped for others to find ways that i might help myself. I may or may not deviate much from their suggestions.
I have and do question some things about RC, but this is not one of them! It is just a distraction. We should focus on those things which are of real value. I would love a list of possible solutions ot given problems. It may not work for me, but at least it will give me something to contemplate and maybe find a similar alternative. Or maybe, i will realize, ‘it is not this issue, but now i see, it is more like this other thing for me.’ Sometimes just being presented with something you disagree with, is enough to help you clarify how you really feel.
So i disagree with this thread. All his members can decide to what extent they will respect or pay homage to the Unification Church. Now if you found clear correlation between his techniques and that of the UC then that would be different! However, it doesn’t appear that he is trying ot get us to practice some subliminal form of UC religion other than coincidal techniques taht may aid in the change process.
Best wishes. I look forward to your reply.
Eddy,
Though off topic (sorry, Warren) I wanted to answer your question.
Love In Action has for many years used “LIA”. Why they decided to name their youth program “Refuge” I have no idea. And I do believe that I did see them use the wording “Love In Action / Refuge”. “LIA/R” was just the natural abreviation, though I doubt they actually used it themselves.
OK, back to regularly scheduled giggling over Richard Cohen and IHF and his shameless book peddling.
OOOPS……………………………………..The book is GAY CHILDREN/STRAIGHT PARENTS (see above comment)
Richard Cohen and INTERNATIONAL HEALING FOUNDATION holds the keys for those wishing to rid themselves of Same Sex Attraction. The work involved is well worth the struggle and though others try to invalidate Cohen’s efforts, God will bring the validation when countless ones are freed and people catch the vision that Change is both Possible and a plan has been outlined to see them through. Cohen has my admiration and thanks for loving those who disagree while staying focused to persevere and get the book GAY PARENTS/STRAIGHT CHILDEN published.
Yep, off topic is an understatement 🙂
Let’s save the LIA/R, ex-gay, football stuff for another thread.
Eddy,
To address your other statement: You don’t say who, you don’t say when, you don’t have a context…just that you’ve ‘heard this before’
I’ve been following the ex-gay movement for over 16 years – I simply cannot remember every article, brochure, web site, email, or TV show I’ve read/seen on the topic – at least not well enough to give you names, dates and places. My time tends to be very limited, but I’ll be happy to do some web research later to see what I can come up with – perhaps it IS the same story.
Eddy,
FURTHER BTW: We are so far off topic it’s embarrassing.
This much I understand and agree with 🙂 – although I haven’t seen anyone jumping in to discuss the topic at hand. Thank you for elaborating on the reason for the football lecture.
Jayhuck–
I actually believe there was a mix going on. Some guys were in work or church situations where the ‘regular guys’ seemed to only connect around the topics of sports or women. Others simply didn’t understand straight guys at all and had a caricature image of them…not very far removed from ‘skirt-chasing jocks’. Others, like me, were befuddled by the fact that although we were fairly intelligent we couldn’t grasp the basics of a game that absorbed the majority of our gender. We felt that a sense of feeling threatened around straight males was what likely caused our inability to comprehend. Still others simply used it as a ‘nobody understands me’ whine.
My own origins were in a town with no Professional Team. But, nearby, New York had two, Philly had one, Baltimore had one, Pittsburgh had one and Wash. DC had one. I think those numbers might hold true for baseball as well. So, maybe it was a unique sports-minded microcosm.
I don’t know the exact tone around LIA but they are out in the San Francisco Bay area. I’m sure some who had been thoroughly entrenched in their own version of the gay lifestyle were both clueless about sports and clueless that men could talk about other things. I’m sure some wanted to practice with ‘light stuff’ like sports before attempting to discuss ‘meaning of life’ issues.
Whatever the reason, you’re giving it too much impact. If every group meeting was temptation focussed, that would not be healthy or balanced. Every once in awhile you tried something unique that seemed to fit the prevailing attitude of the group. I took our group ‘winter tubing’…just wanted them to enjoy some good wholesome fun with a bunch of guys. Another time we went horseback riding. It wasn’t a regular part of the program. The group wanted to ‘do something’ as a group and one of the guys had a friend who owned a stable and could get us a deal. So, we did it. A group excercise that the group chose. Same with the football lecture. It seemed to be a common topic of interest among the majority of the group so you find a way to address it and have a light moment.
BTW: I still haven’t heard back from Dave or Timothy re whether LIA/R was Love In Action’s unfortunate goof or their own creation.
FURTHER BTW: We are so far off topic it’s embarrassing.
Eddy,
I guess the reason I find it (the football lecture) odd, is that so many other straight men I know who don’t watch football don’t require a lecture on football to relate to other straight men – I’ve never required such a lecture to relate to straight men either. I guess I’m having a hard time understanding why these guys – or others – have felt it necessary to do this. Were the guys they were trying to relate to so focused on sports they couldn’t talk about anything else? I am willing to admit that maybe I’m missing something here. LOL 🙂
Thanks, Jayhuck–
I’m curious as to who those other groups are, though. I haven’t heard of them. My gut says that since LIA is one of the best known Exodus ministries and that they’ve likely shared their experiences at Exodus conferences, these stories you’ve heard are all actually this very same one…blown up to make it appear that it’s more widespread than it is. Please tell me what you can about these other sports stories you’ve heard and I’ll do what I can to find out if they are different stories or simply a retelling of the same story I told.
I do find it ironic though that I go to the trouble of backing up my second-hand impressions of the LIA program from post 52834 by inviting someone who was ACTUALLY THERE to comment on my accuracy and you respond with: I’ve heard this before and with other groups. LOL! You don’t say who, you don’t say when, you don’t have a context…just that you’ve ‘heard this before’…and then, based on that very limited knowledge, you feel qualified to judge that ‘the whole football lecture thing is ridiculous’.
(If you weren’t suggesting that the specific example I used was part of this, your use of the word ‘whole’ was a careless misstatement. Doesn’t ‘whole’ still mean ‘entire’? Doesn’t ‘entire’ mean ‘totally, without exception’?) Elsewhere you suggested that Warren change his wording to suit your view, that’s why it puzzles me so when you say what you said instead of “my impression, though, is that SOME have taken Eddy’s valid example and gone ridiculous”. If you had said that rather than what you did, we’d have spared ourselves (and the rest of the readers) this little detour.
UK beat LSU today in overtime –
Eddy,
I also want to be clear that this method of using sports in ex-gay groups is one that I’ve heard before and with other groups – I was really attempting to speak to the bigger idea and not just this one particular instance. I really AM sorry!
Well, I sure didn’t watch any football on tv anyway. I did take in a flag football game this morning.
But what does this have to do with UC and IHF? Look, IDK but prob we are all BFF so IDC about FB and LIA. How about returning to the TOTP?
LOL? 🙂
Jayhuck–Why do you begin by saying your comment isn’t addressed to me and then follow with “This whole football lecture idea is ridiculous”. I brought the football lecture up…and I rationalized why they did it…how is your comment NOT directed to me and my comments?
In my short comment, I specifically laid out the basic profile of their clients when they did this, what does your statement say to that? That it wasn’t true because you know gay guys who are into sports? Yeah, so do I–but I wasn’t talking about them and I made that very clear. The very fact that I specifically defined these individuals as being a unique gay subset…and that the lecture was designed to meet that specific need…seems to have missed you entirely.
Did you feel that you needed to bring that up just to make sure that we all understood that not all gays were effeminate? At this point, that’s a bit insulting to all of us who blog here. If we have to cover and re-cover and then re-cover every sensitive point in every conversation, we’ll get nowhere very, very fast.
Eddy, this isn’t addressed to you, just to that absurd idea that gay people don’t play sports or don’t know anything about them – or that ex-gay camps/programs should teach about sports as a “way of connecting” with straight men.
My best friend who is gay has season tickets to his college alma mater’s football games and attends almost all of them – He knows more about football than the straight guys I know.
Most of the straight guys I know know next to nothing about football or other sports, yet they don’t have any problems connecting with other straight guys. This whole football lecture idea is ridiculous. I don’t much about football, but I also don’t have any problems connecting with straight guys. Not all straight guys watch football, and many of them don’t play sports.
Heard back from my friend who actually lived in two different LIA residences while she worked there. Her response was that I had it ‘exactly right’. From her perspective, the ‘weirdest’ things to outsiders were the dress code and having a straight guy come in to explain football. (As weird as that sounds, I recall clients who had issues with ‘connecting with straight men’ at church because they had zero skills or knowledge of things that guys often talk about.) Now, if they actually made them play football…that would have been over the top.
Timothy: To quote a movie title “Say Anything”! You’re currently stuck at 666 on the comment meter.
Timothy/David–
I left Exodus before the Memphis Refuge thing got started (or at least before they attracted any attention) -now, there’s something I’ve really got to know. Did THEY come up with LIA/R or did you guys? A most unfortunate anacronym!
Timothy’s insightful statement re the serious error of submitting these children to tales of adult fetishes is absolutely true. It makes me want to scream “What Were They Thinking?!” I didn’t even want my adult clients hearing that stuff. Heck, I didn’t really want to hear the sordid details either unless I had to. Personally, I believe that stuff belongs in a ‘one to one’ session–not a group.
I learned from my exposure to Teen Challenge that testimonies and confessions can turn into a ‘can you top this?’ session. My struggle is harder; my pain is deeper; my life was more wild; my addiction was more severe. They actually had issues of people going ‘back into sin’ with the notion of coming back with a ‘bigger testimony’. It’s why I can’t help reading Shakespeare’s homage in a modern day tone. “What a piece of work is man! How noble in reason!” I’ve always read it with a “you’re a real piece of work” inflection. Amazing what the mind can wrap itself around and think it makes sense.
Just as I never understood that whole boot camp thing; I don’t understand and could never support forcing anyone to take part in such therapies. If a child was sent there in handcuffs that weren’t placed there by the court, wouldn’t some laws apply? Can parents handcuff-or have a child handcuffed-with no fear of legal consequences?
David–
Still checking on this one but I think that LIA’s basic residency programs were a bit different from the program at the Refuge…they were akin to ‘halfway houses’-situated in the Bay area. I think people had liberties to come and go. I’m reasonably sure that the infamous dress code was in place at both but I’m thinking that the Refuge may have been more ‘intensive’–trying to do things in a much shorter timeframe–and with no come and go liberties.
My friend has promised to check in on this topic. (I created, copied and sent my very first ‘link’…so proud of myself. One other time, I sent a ‘link’ that was already there–all blue and pretty and all–but this time I says to myself…try clicking on the title and see if any options pop up. And, voila! No dummy, here, BTW. I followed the link back here just to be sure it really worked.) Don’t know if she’ll comment but, if not, I’ll pass on whatever relevant info she can provide.
Tim and David,
Thanks!!!!!
Yeah, it was and is difficult to wade through all the odd stories surrounding LIA/R. I doubt we have heard the last of them, either.
Thanks, David. I wasn’t sure if that story had ever been substantiated so I used “claims to have been”.
While there may have been another who claimed this of which I am unaware, I’m fairly certain that this turned out to be false. We ran across this while checking over the facts in response to a challenge from LIA recently.
BTW, the recent Exodus study book from Jones and Yarhouse describes LIA as a residential program.
Jayhuck,
Love In Action/Refuge is the Memphis live-in program that you are referring to. LIA/R received quite a bit of media attention after one kid blogged that he was being forced to attend and then posted LIA/R’s rules, which incidated some bizarre obsessions with brands of clothing.
There is some confusion as to whether minors were actually live-in residents or whether they stayed at a nearby motel with parents during the night and only were on-site during the day. However, there is no question that some minors were in joint sessions with sexual addicts and sexual abusers and were exposed to sexual “testimony” about things that were far outside their familiarity or experiences. They were, as best we can tell, sexually inexperienced kids with same-sex attraction who were exposed to hardcore fetish discussions.
It is also unclear exactly how many minors participated in LIA/R. And it is uncertain how many did so of their own volition. We do know, however, that at least two teens went through the program against their wishes and one claims to have been taken there in handcuffs.
good morning! My friend checked in and cleared some things up. The California based Love In Action only had live in programs and, as far as she knows, everyone was there voluntarily. (She actually resided in one of the houses.) An offshoot, though, was formed in Tennessee and is where she believes the young kid must have been sent. Another of my former colleagues checked in and said he’s pretty sure that the Mormons also had a camp style format.
So it looks like this parental forcing issue was incidental. (Except of course if you were one of the kids who was forced.) I’m having flashbacks to the Jenny Jones and the ‘bootcamps’ for troubled kids. It sounds like they may have gotten caught up in that mentality.
Eddy,
My question also involves those kids whose parents simply take them to therapy too though. Does this really happen?
Hey Eddy – sorry – I had two very intense and important exams to study for and had to stay away from blogging to focus on them. Thanks for checking on that for me.
Jayhuck–
There you are…it’s been about a week. Back when I was involved, Love In Action was the only group I knew of that had a live-in program or camp. I believe its possible that some of the other West Coast ministries may have had camps also. My impression was that it was a “California kind of thing”…I sure didn’t understand it. I used to say “Having a live-in program for ex-gays is like having a Teen Challenge with marijuana plants growing on the windowsills.”
LOL! I just remembered that the friend I JUST e-mailed went from here to Love In Action before moving on. I’ll send her a follow-up and maybe get you an answer from close to the source. I am pretty sure though that the story you’re alluding to is true. I don’t know if she’ll have any specific knowledge of that, though.
All,
This discussion brings up something I’ve been meaning to ask for awhile. Were/are parents really sending their kids off to receive (reorientation) therapy because they don’t agree with homosexuality? I remember hearing some story about a kid named Zach who was 16 and who was sent off to an, I believe, Love in Action camp against his will, but – regardless – I wasn’t sure if this was a common occurrence or not????
Ann –
Thank you for the clarification…
Check out who he endorses – perhaps there is reciprocity.
who are the ex-gay or otherwise groups that endorse and support Richard Cohen and his organization?
Ann,
I agree with you. Very good illustrations.
Jag,
I am not comparing a child who identifies himself or herself as gay the same as a house burning down. I was equating the difference one feels when they watch either themselves or a loved one reach out, sometimes beg for help, and have it met with indifference. I felt this could explain why so many parents and those with unwanted SSA could fall for unethical organizations. If more people would listen to those that are reaching out, whether they can help or not, I think it would prevent unethical organizations from appearing so appealing to begin with. Desperate people do desperate things and I was trying to point that out and see if there was a way to mitigate that through compassion in listening rather than indifference. My example was meant to offer a solution rather than a commendation of Richard Cohen.
Ann –
I differ with your perspective on this:
” It is like watching your home burn down and you are screaming out to the people passing by to help you and all they are saying is “oh, just accept it” as they go to their home that is still in tact. The silence of indifference is deafening. The person who stops, grabs a hose, calls the fire department and tells you they will help – are you going to turn them down regardless of what their background is?”
One thought, is that you make the assumption that the methods (“grabs a hose”) work. In the illustration you give, this is the case…we all know that water puts out a fire, but in the case of Richard Cohen, he is offering something that provides hope – but no results. His methods are not in alignment with current acceptable practice and his beliefs are not in line with research.
To make your example more relevant to Richard Cohen…It is like watching your home burn down, and he states “I will save your home” and comes running with teaspoons of sugar. It might give you temporary hope, but that’s about all it offers.
I find it deceptive, and sad. It misleads parents about “knowing” the origin of sexual orientation (which we do not know for certain), and misleads them further that all individuals can change and we know the methods that do this for sure with adequate commitment (untrue). What terrible strife this must cause so many families when this is not the case for them or their loved ones. His misinformation breaks families apart.
Also, as a side note, I would hardly compare having a gay child to “watching your home burn down.” So many parents focus so much on the attractions of their child, that they forget that many are “good kids,” worthy of support and understanding. I’m not saying that all must “accept it,” but I am saying that the attitude that having a gay child is the end of the world is what often leads to evicting their children from the home, etc. It is simply one part of many parts of your child. Even if you believe their attractions are a sin…we all sin…hardly the house burning down.
I would hope that parents are offered adequate resources, but feel, as does Pam and Warren, that far too many parents would grasp at just about anything if it promises change.
Joseph P – thanks for the link. Now here is another one of those coincidences I was referring to. Jarish Cohen, son of Richard of International Healing Foundation seems to be involved with the Unification Church or whatever name it is called now, also as recently as 2005. The announcement states THE Words of the Cohen Family, A Healing Seminar for Second Generation a forwarded message from Rev. Phillip Schanker, Vice President for Education, Unification Church or whatever it is called now. This appears to be an announcement (in Moonie langauge) for one of Cohen’s seminars given at a hotel near the Baltimore Washington Airport. Now, isn’t that something, the Moon organization promoting Richard Cohen’s programs, including his son and they aren’t members? So we have a son, fronting for his father? So, when did using ones family, pictures, bios, etc., to promote one’s coaching (or is it counseling) practice? And there is another reference for 2004 to Jessica Cohen, Richard Cohen’s daughter involved with the Blessed family department of the Moon organization. And I’m sure if more research were done there would be more and more references to Moon and Richard Cohen and family. There is another reference from a Moon data base that Hilde Wiemann’s name appeared in an 1992 ad for the International Healing Foundation in Unification News (the Unification Church newspaper at the time). She is listed as an assistant. Here is the Link about Cohen’s son Jarish Cohen (names him as “a Blessed member”) and refers to his father (Richard Cohen) as a ….”licensed counselor” (licensed by whom?).
From: Rev. Phillip Schanker
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 9:40 PM
Subject: A Healing Seminar for Second Generation
Dear Vice-regional Directors and State Leaders,
The program described below is designed for Second Generation teens and above, and their parents, for the purpose of resolving difficult parent-child relationships, healing emotional wounds, and achieving intimacy. It is not an official program of the Family Federation, and is not being sponsored by HQ. It is being organized by a Blessed member of our Second Generation now studying at UPenn, and will be led by his father, who is a nationally known author, licensed counselor and someone who worked through many painful personal issues to achieve a loving and strong Blessed Family. I had a deeply meaningful experience in a similar healing seminar some months ago, and have occasionally referred those dealing with the wounds of childhood sexual abuse or struggles with same-sex attraction. A number of Second Generation youth have attended with their parent(s). It may be very helpful for any young person experiencing deep pain, profound anger, or struggling with intense emotional issues.
Those interested should read the description carefully and contact the organizer. This program is experiential, and asks for sincere personal involvement. It is not lectures and presentations, but group experiences and personal interaction. All of the necessary information is included below. If you forward this information to any person or family in your region, please use only the information below, with the son’s name as a reference and point of contact with love and prayer,
Rev. Phillip Schanker VP for Education
——————————————————————————–
Summer Healing Seminar
Find a Safe and Supportive Place to Heal and Grow;
Achieve Deeper Intimacy with God and Those You Love;
Resolve Painful and Difficult Relationships; Experience Love in Action!
Date: June 11-12, 2005
Time: 9am-5pm each day
Location: hotel outside of BWI airport in Baltimore, Maryland
Cost: $150
Contact Organizer: Jarish Cohen
My Inspiration for putting this together:
Like many of our Second Generation, much of my life has been filled with painful experiences of sacrifice and relationships that were less than ideal. I struggled so much to find out who I was, where I fit in. I didn’t feel loved, I felt worthless, and I felt empty inside. This led to a lot of unhealthy behavior and trying to find love in all the wrong places. A year and a half ago, God intervened in my life and I have experienced amazing healing and love ever since, primarily from my family.
When I ‘came back’ to the movement, I realized I was not alone. I saw then and still see today, so many of our Second Generation struggling to find their identity and feel loved. Lack of love is the deepest pain one can experience and it breaks my heart to see so many of those around me with pain in their hearts and souls. I want healing to occur in their lives and thus I am putting together a healing seminar to do just that. This will not be just another seminar or workshop. This is a great opportunity to heal one’s heart and grow as a person and as a child of God.
-Jarish Cohen
Seminar Leader/Facilitator:
My father, who has invested many years of education, training and experience, becoming a nationally-famous author and counselor in the area of healing emotional wounds and achieving intimacy in relationships.
Description:
This seminar is for Second Generation and their parents who want to experience personal transformation. It will teach new ways to intimacy with oneself, others and God. This is an opportunity to access personal thoughts/feelings that may be blocking personal growth and achieving healthy relationships. It will be a two-day experiential seminar combining cognitive understandings with emotional processes, where vital life skills will be enhanced, and hope rekindled.
In a safe, non-judgmental environment, hearts will be healed, minds will be mended, and spirits set free! The topics include, discovering your inner child, reconciling relationships, experiencing the healing power of healthy touch, and fulfilling unmet love needs in healthy relationships. Experience a new way of being and the power of love in action. All participants are welcome to open up, share their deepest concerns, and allow remarkable healing to occur.
Here is another interesting little link for anyone who want to dig a little deeper…
http://www.tparents.org/Library/Unification/Talks/Cohen/Cohen-050430.htm
Whether Wiemann is or was a member of the UC is really not the issue here. People seeking therapy and help from any organization do have the right to ask questions and expect honest answers. I wonder how many of you have really read the links that Warren has provided? Mrs. Wiemann states in several of her answers : “I have never been in such a position with that church….” and “that” church (stating this several times in her other answers as well ; it has a negative tone to it, doesn’t it?). I would find it hard to believe that she really left UC, because she states that she left THAT church in 1995, but there are several links with her name as a volunteer and a paid employee up through 2005. I have been reading the links that Warren has provided. In the UTS Alumni News link September 13, 2005, Section 8 “….It is wonderful to see the wife of alumnus John Wiemann (UTS ’78) being so active to help youth.” The paragraph continues stating how many times they are meeting at Wiemann’s house, giving the address and telephone number RSVP early, because we like to keep the group under 10 people, small cosy and frutiful. “Aunt Hilde” will lead the group, assisted by….” So her husband was a member of UC, since she has not stated that her husband has left THAT church, he is probably still a member.
In these link pages, they are speaking in the present at that time, meaning September of 2005. There are several other examples of this also. This this is not referring back to pre-1995. So how does this reconcile with Hilde’s protestation that she left UC in 1995? Moonies, Cohen included, are always in the habit of blurring the timeline and putting out a hazy mist of denial and being overly defensive. Like, you don’t have any right whatsoever to question me and my poop don’t stink either. However, for those who do their research and actually read the evidence, I think that it definitely points to serious problems of telling the truth. She can protest all she wants, but there is far too much evidence that she was a member of UC far beyond 1995 that shows that she was actively and intimately involved with UC organizations and members. Thank you Warren for your excellent research and shedding light on the truth.
Tim brought this up, so to make me look bad, as he has nothing better to do then to personally attack others.
Irony is amusing, isn’t it?
I wish you well, Jim. I just hope that you can cease attacking everyone else here (Warren, Pam, David, myself) long enough to see that the criticism laid on Cohen are based on his behaviors and his deceptions. They are not ad hominem and they are not without merit. This is not some example of religious or anti-ex-gay bigotry.
This is an example of those who are informed about ex-gay issues, both favorably and skeptically, identifying an area of dishonesty and bringing it to light. Honorable people do not fear the light.
W: Yes, that was a broad generalization, I agree, not right, my bad, very sorry; please forgive, no hate here. -Jim
Jim,
Thank you for your response to me and the comments and information you shared.
Jim P,
Thank you for taking the time to explain about your education.
Jim Phelan wrote: …”something gays hate to hear.”
Jim, you don’t comment much and so I let that go but will not continue to let such broad generalizations be posted. I don’t think you would take it kindly, nor would it be accurate to say all reorientation therapists are narrow minded and insulting to gays and so it does not seem proper to engage in the same.
Jack, I earned my Psy.D is from the Southern California University for Professional Studies, thanks for asking. Yes, this was an external degree program. I am not licensed at that degree level, however. I merely achieved it for gaining more substance in psychology as my grad degree was in social work (Received from Marywood University – not an external degree; I earned it on campus) and is more of a generalist degree. I am fully licensed at the master’s level and have been since 1994, however. I am also board certified in clinical social work (BCD). I have all the rights to practice psychotherapy and bill insurances as an independent clinician. The Psy.D is irrelevant of that. Tim brought this up, so to make me look bad, as he has nothing better to do then to personally attack others. To that end, I never assumed “intellectual superiority over those who chose the old-fashioned methods of education,” to being with. I was merely speaking truth, something gays hate to hear. BTW: I too chose the old-fashion method for my terminal degree in social work from Marywood. (Google that too if you like). I have no problem with that. I am not in the business of intellectual competitions, rather I am in the business of helping others. I merely speak what is true.
Tim,
From what institution did Phelan get his degree? Please share what you know.
This has all been so enlightening. Thanks for the post and update Warren. I don’t know that I have anything to add that hasn’t already been said or of worth. I can see why you made the post and trust that you will follow through as the events unfold.
Jim,
For someone so concerned with Dr. Throckmorton’s licensing and that the blog is full of “air brains”, I find it surprising that you chose to get a mail order degree.
I’m not suggesting that this disqualifies you from practice or that you did not get the socialization experiences that most college students receive by some other means. And considering how little time it takes to become degreed as well as how inexpensive it is to have education that doesn’t require interaction with an educator, it really is quite a bargain. I congratulate you on your wise use of time and resources.
But it does surprise me that you would assume intellectual superiority over those who chose the old-fashioned methods of education. That’s all.
W: LOL, A fan of both Cohen and Besen, I must be schizophrenic; pass the meds Jerryn! “Top 10 commenters” LOL; I’m not in competition with Timothy Kincaid and Mary. As for the other offers, I’ll pass; other forums. Thanks, Jp
Jim, don’t leave now, I was hoping you would get in my top ten commenters list.
Where did you get the idea that I do not do “this work?” Do you have data? You can describe it here if you like.
I do have satisfaction data (above 90% since 1986) but not change data. Not really sure what point you are making.
I can tell you read Besen’s column. Since he is the only other one who chooses to characterize my work in the way you have.
Actually, as a fan of Richard’s you should be ok with my current licensing status.
@ Ann
Sorry if I misunderstood, I’ll wait and see what you come up with.
@ Jim
Trying to keep you on track in a discussion is like trying to get a firm grip on Jell-o. Since you seem to be able to carry on both sides of a conversation by yourself, I’ll attend to other things.
…take lies and thank you for them…
Boy, that goes on all over the place. I see it in the financial industry, churches, gay activists (not all), etc… and really bad relationships that your insecure friends are mixed up in.
David,
I do understand what you are saying and agree. What I was saying was completely different than what you responded to. I guess I am not being effective in articulating what I am trying to say so let me re-think it and try again later. Thanks for your response.
PS: David R., when you start telling the truth on such basic principles such as: homosexuality is pathological and curable, then we’ll talk. Otherwise, these other housekeeping issues such as, he said, she said, are not very essential.
Okay, I will respond to Ann et al., and leave meds, or other interventions, to assist Jerryn (besides, why respond to someone who paraphrases “Big Daddy”) and then I will stop my part in this fussy string that is apparently going nowhere and landing on a bunch of air brains (and I’m naive?). Okay, simply said, and I’ll spare the dissertation; Cohen doesn’t operate a 911 rescue center! People have choices. Thank God for America! And thanks Ann, for sharing your personal belief that “Dr. Throckmorton has the most progressive thoughts about the kind of treatments that are individual and ethical…” however, some in the field find it alarming, that he who is unlicensed to practice this work, and claims he doesn’t even do it (thus, no data), prescribes “guidelines” to those who do!
Ann,
Warren pretty much answered your question to me. This is not a matter of personal beliefs or perceptions, it’s black and white. As for truth per se, I certainly hope we have not reached a point when we each have our own private, equally valid version of it. As I said before, if our debates do not lead to the clarification of some basic, common truth for all, then we are not really accomplishing anything, are we?
Dr. Throckmorton,
I was not addressing or questioning anything you wrote – I am glad you posted the article and completely understood what you were saying – I was addressing David’s post and what he wrote.
Ultimately, Cohen’s religious affilitations may have no bearing on the accuracy or efficacy of his methods. But they do call into question his judgment and wisdom.
Timothy,
This was so easy to read and I agree with you 100%.
Ann – First of all my questions were not directed at Cohen’s religious beliefs but rather the referral to someone who might not be as billed. Also, the truth is not about what religion to believe. It is about what plain language means. Official church websites give descriptions; when someone says no that is not true, then there is a dissonance that can only be resolved by truth. For instance, Mrs. Wiemann cannot both be and not be national level co-director of coaching for the Unification movement. The official websites say one thing; she says another. You all will decide which seems more plausible.
If I learn more and it is relevant, I will post it.
David,
I just realized that maybe the word “question” is not what I was trying to convey. We all have a right to question things and people and both of them together if we don’t understand or agree. What I am trying to ask is this – do we have a right to criticize another’s perception of the truth just because we don’t see it the same way. I do understand that things like public policy, etc. have a common truth to them that we all understand but I am referring to personal perceptions.
David,
I respect things you have written and the way you have written them. I understand your concern about the truth – it is vital. I do have a question about the subject of truth though – isn’t each other’s truth a matter of their individual perception? Because you might believe something that I don’t think is the truth, is it my place to question your personal belief? Same with my beliefs or anyone else’s – is it our place to question them?
Ultimately, Cohen’s religious affilitations may have no bearing on the accuracy or efficacy of his methods. But they do call into question his judgment and wisdom.
Jim said:
No, you are missing the point Jim. Warren just explained that it’s not the fact that Cohen might be associated with the UC that he finds most disturbing, it is that Cohen is saying things which appear to contradict the available facts. If this does not concern you, then really anything else you could say about Cohen is irrelevant. When one does not value the truth, the debate is over.
After a couple of weeks worth of listening to “true believers” insist on the goodness of Chris Austin after his conviction for sexually assaulting his clients, I find Jim’s dogged defense of Cohen quite believable. Some people want to believe so much that they will take lies and thank you for them.
It’s quite disturbing really.
Pam,
I agree. I have heard some desperate misguided parents fall to the absurd.
Pam,
Yes, you are right – people who are desperately seeking to save their children’s lives (physically and emotionally) will go to any measure to do so. It is like watching your home burn down and you are screaming out to the people passing by to help you and all they are saying is “oh, just accept it” as they go to their home that is still in tact. The silence of indifference is deafening. The person who stops, grabs a hose, calls the fire department and tells you they will help – are you going to turn them down regardless of what their background is? Have you ever loved anyone so much that you experience a sense of feeling desperate when they reach out for help and it is met with indifference or contempt from others? I am very grateful for all the resources available to those who are questioning their homosexuality – there are many that I think are unethical and immoral – many are just the opposite. The organized religion part of some of these groups is meaningless to some, and for others, it means everything. There is no need to diminish a parent’s love for their children by questioning what they will initially believe out of desperation and indifference from those they seek help from. With time and self education and kowledge, they and their children will find their way. Information and ethical resources are more available now than they ever were and I do not underestimate anyone’s intelligence to ultimately discover if a treatment is right or wrong for them – it is all a very personal assessment and should never be generalized. My personal belief is that Dr. Throckmorton has the most progressive thoughts about the kind of treatments that are individual and ethical and I look forward to how they will be received by both those seeking treatment and the therapists who apply them.
Jim – For a Psydoc you are soooooo naive. You and your naive NARTH cronies have allowed yourselves to be taken in by Cohen’s manipulations and internet craziness, not to mention his permanent expulsion from ACA more than 5 years ago for serious ethical violations. And you still give him any professional or otherwise credbility? The ACA expulsion alone should have been more than enough to tell you that this guy has serious problems so distance yourselves from him. This has cost NARTH bigtime all while NARTH keeps sinking deeper with serious credibility problems.
Yes, indeed, to paraphrase Big Daddy said in Cat on a Hot Tin Roof, “I can smell the mendacity.. Cohen has had these problems to telling the truth for years and always trying to backpedal himself out of lies, deception and half-truths. Well, there are just too many coincidences here and too many denials for there not to be something amiss with all of this. People have the right to know what Warren has presented here. If Cohen and/or his associates want to deny or give their version, fine, put it on the record for all to see. Kudos to Warren for bringing light on something that desperately needs it.
W: You are still missing the point…..which is: So what! So what IF she held/holds position(s) for that organization. It has nothing to do with her role in IHF or her role in helping others. It is minute in terms of outcomes unless one is so entrenched in their own legalism that they can’t see beyond reality. J.
Jim – I would be interested to know what your take is on the websites of the UC that refer to Mrs. Wiemann’s involvement. She has an explanation for them but it is still hard for me to see how the UC would on two official sites designate leadership positions, if indeed they were not so.
If you think I care what faith someone holds as far as their ability to help another person, you are misreading me. My point is that my eyes plainly read something that was denied by Mrs. Wiemann and Mr. Cohen. I do not for sure know what that means, maybe you do; I would be curious to know what you think it means. When there is a discrepancy of such magnitude, it raises concerns about credibility.
An example, if you read on an official website of Scientology that I was a leader in that movement, even though I said I wasn’t; would there not be some questions about my statement?
Warren: Yes, I think it is important to reduce ambiguity. However, Cohen is not so much about “Here are the steps, just follow them”, but rather, “Here are some step to follow; this is what I found to be useful, I hope this can help you, too.” Give evangelicals some credit; they are not so naive in which they are reduced to not use an array of resources to help them. That is why such things like PATH (Positive Alternative to Homosexuality) exist.
Pam F.
Stop the paranoia. Richard Cohen is NOT “undergirded by a Unification Church worldview” as you claim. But if he were, or by any other religious orientation (contrary to your own, of course) it would not matter in the course of one man trying to help others out of homosexuality. Stop the hate, stop the division, this is the heart’s cry.
Pam – I am afraid you are close to the truth on this. Having just covered therapeutic bias in the classes I teach, I am aware that there is a huge market for people wanting to achieve whatever it is that they believe will bring them happiness or whatever the desired goal is. The appeal of Cohen’s message (you too can come out straight) is the reduction of ambiguity. Here are the steps, just follow them.
I have a sinking feeling that it wouldn’t really matter if we discovered that someone like Cohen practiced witchcraft and danced naked by the light of the moon, if fundamentalist parents thought he could help their gay child be straight, they’d buy his book.
Jag-
In Conservative and Evangelical Christian circles, IVP still holds a lot of credibility. The Unification Church connections would likely tarnish this reputation.
Jim,
I do not know you – but have seen Cohen in action. And as an ex gay woman who does support SIT and reparative therapy (for those who seek it) I do not support those such as Cohen. If Cohen needs exposing for his poor methods, treatment of others, lack of discretion, etc…and misleading the public, his clients and himself then that is what it is. Cohen is not an advocate of mine and I AM EX GAY. I am not an advocate of him. His public demonstrations of himself have done more harm to those who are trying to find out if change is possible for them than anything Throckmorton or anyone can say or do.
Dr Throckmorton – You are exceedingly kind in your revised post. Too kind actually. It seems quite clear that Mrs. Wiemann was viewed by Moon’s organization as a member and a key one at that. Leading retreats, and a national ministry do not seem to be jobs the UC outsource. The scope of denial of what seems obvious may actually reveal the degree of reality you have uncovered.
Jim,
I’m sure-as-shootin’ that my words will have little affect on your opinion, nevertheless, I’ll put them forth for your admonishment.
Dr. T. is just making the point here that Richard Cohen’s books sell like hotcakes to fundamentalists Christian parent types who are looking (grasping) for any reason whatsoever that their children may be gay. Those same parents are looking for any hope whatsoever that thier child’s gayness might be changed. Now, considering the fact that most of those folks have very firm beliefs in a specific God, with specific methods, and certainly specific ways of looking at things wholistically, it just might be of importance for those folks to understand that Mr. Cohen is undergirded by a Unification Church worldview. If that sort of worldview is not that big a deal, then why hide it? The “light” needs to be shed on the ENTIRE ex-gay movement…..and those parts of it which are working acceptably within that light….have nothing to fear.
You say, “As for the book, I may review it soon as there are significant problems with it.” You haven’t even reviewed it, by your own admission, but say there are “significant problems” with it….but I’m sure the author, (your witch hunt of him is very well established at this point) has something to do with this bias.
You also say, “Everything I have written is backed up by evidence, most of it, in the links provided in the post.” Okay, but what is written to begin with is not relevant. A person’s religious orientation is not grounds to discriminate against them, something you allude to. IHF’s mission is simply one man’s course of helping others go “gay to straight”, not to recruit others to any particular religion. I don’t think any evangelical in their right mind worries about catching a “Moonie” bug.
You look for any opportunity to sensationalize this man, over accentuate him, so spare us your appraisals; they are old, predicable. Your forthcoming review unwelcome, only on course for negativity, division, devil’s food for the ex-gay watchers. It helps no one, only hurts.
Warren,
Thank you for your report. A couple of points.
I am sure you are aware that the Moon organization does not distinguish between its “religion” and politics unless it comes in handy for them to scream they are being persecuted. They have used “religion” to cover for their political efforts to undermine what Americans’ hold dear like no other group.
Quoting the Fraser Report released in 1978 – Wood met with Moon many times and ran his political fronts:
http://tinyurl.com/yqbkw7
The point here is that being critical of Moon’s “religion” is no different than being critical of the John Birch Society or Lyndon Larouche’s organization except that Moon’s organization has been wildly successful. Moon’s is a political organization first and foremost – designed to promote Moon’s homophobic, theocratic, authoritarian, union hating ideology which Moon will tell you is all God’s will. Note also Moon’s organization helped many torturing fascist regimes in South America, so I would add “fascist” to that list of things he promotes.
I do hope, as he claims, that Mr. Cohen has gotten away from the disgusting Moon organization but it looks like he is still pushing the ideology. He says he left the “church” in 1995 which just happens to be when Moon disbanded the Unification Church and renamed it. Moon himself could claim to longer be a member of it.
Moon was shifting gears in the mid 90s – starting on his increasingly successful efforts to influence the United Nations and the name change was part of it. Moon only sees the world’s religions’ purpose, the reason God created them, was so they could all accept him as the messiah. He says the time of religion has passed away and now it is time for the world to be influenced and absorbed by his movement.
The question to ask Cohen should be “do you subscribe to the philosophy and tenants of Sun Myung Moon and/or do you belong to or associate with any organization founded or inspired by Sun Myung Moon or others who subscribe to the philosophy and tenants of Sun Myung Moon?”
Before anyone yaps about McCarthy – try learning about this group and its stated goals. Time magazine in 1976 quoted Moon as saying,
The reason people ask about moonies’ “religion” is they need to know if they are still working to promote Moon and his ideology which is ALL the Moon org does. Apparently Cohen understands the ramifications of this so he lied about not having moonies in his company. Moon followers pledge their allegiance upon waking to Moon and the Fatherland, Korea.
The Washington Times claims to be independent of Moon – which is not true, the WT has been a main cog in Moon’s plans to promote his ideology – but all these people know Americans don’t want to promote Moon, not knowingly and for good reason. It is a very important and legitimate question and has nothing to do with “religion” and everything to do with not wanting to support a megalomaniac whose organization has swindled hundreds of millions from the Japanese targeting widows, has disrupted families all over the world, spent billions in overseas cash successfully manipulating our political system and most assuredly has a desire to control the direction of world events.
The fact that Cohen lied to you just shows he is still in the moonie deceiving mode on some level. Former members say they were taught what they call “heavenly deception” which means it is OK to lie to save the world for God and Moon. I have yet to find anything the group does which is not rooted in deception.
Josette Shiner was a key cog in Moon’s propaganda machine for over 20 years. People who Anne Bardach interviewed for her article published in 2004, said say Shiner ran the Washington Times until she left it in the mid 90s. One former member said he personally witnessed her taking direct orders from Moon on what he wanted done at the Washington Times. She also left the “church” when Moon changed its name. When she went to work at the State Department she said she no longer was in contact with Moon’s organization and acted like her “religion” was off limits. Hogwash.
She was going to work in the Trade Reps office and this is one of Moon’s vision for the world …
again quoting the Fraser report quoting Moon:
As you can see, Moon’s ideology is extremely important and pertinet to her new job at State. In a sane world she would have been asked detailed questions but she has received a pass.
Long time Moon followers will tell you it is unlikely someone has made a clean break form the organization if they still are in regular contact with followers, it is very difficult since the group is so controlling.
“I have no association with the Unification Church since I left the Washington Times in 1997.” Shiner told AP in November of 2006:
Well, turns out Josette hired a long time moonie to be her senior advisor when she took the job at the State Department. http://www.innercitypress.com/wfp110606.html
Moon has given over 3 million dollars to Bush family interests just since 43 took office. http://www.talk2action.org/story/2007/5/3/203729/4512
The Bush administration recently appointed Josette to head the World Food Program. After being caught with a doctored resume, she got the job.
http://www.innercitypress.com/wfp110706.html
If you look – and few have – you will see he has more to do with the political cliff this nation has been falling off since the 1980s than anyone. He outspent Scaife many fold promoting the hard right.
Moon’s own daughter in law called him a con man.
see the end of this video
http://video.aol.com/video-detail/nan-sook-hong/1354477572
Quoting James Whelan, the first editor of Moon’s Washington Times. Whelan quit the paper saying he had “blood on his hands” for helping Moon gain credibility. Whelan knows what he is talking about.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=9008719207533458404&hl=en
I am amazed at how little the gay community knows about Moon – given that he has promoted all the people who oppose them. You should have seen the photo of him laughing as they showed him pictures of his followers protesting in Mass. when they were looking at marriage rights for all.
All Moon’s efforts use cash from overseas, much of it swindled targeting widows in Japan.
http://tinyurl.com/39ejt
a disgusting organization…
Eddy –
“Have you contacted IVP with your concerns? Your documentation seems thorough enough to give them enough grounds to investigate further. As HS has indicated, this could seriously damage their credibility.”
To be honest Eddy, IVP has no credibility in the academic community…and little anywhere else.
Jim – I must truly be a projective test. LaBabera thinks I am Switzerland, Besen a sociopath and now you a fundamentalist.
As for the book, I may review it soon as there are significant problems with it. More on that another time.
And regarding Mrs. Wiemann, I have consulted with her and will be reporting on that soon. Everything I have written is backed up by evidence, most of it, in the links provided in the post.
Are you not for full disclosure? Fundamentalist or not, I am sure you know the research about values and persuasion in therapy. Clients tend to take on the values of therapists, hence, when Christians are looking for like minded help, it would be reasonable for them to get honest answers about such things.
Oh yes Warren so someone will turn vicariously “Moonie” if they deal with IHF? Sounds like paranoia! Do all the the fundamentalists, like you have all the answers? IVP is wise to publish the book because lots of wounded parents need help and they certainly won’t get it from reading your site. Additionally, you should consult with Mrs. Wiemann before speaking about her in a public domain.
Warren,
Thanks for the work on keeping up with this man. His approach to helping others seems questionable even by ex gay standards. LOL
Warren,
Have you contacted IVP with your concerns? Your documentation seems thorough enough to give them enough grounds to investigate further. As HS has indicated, this could seriously damage their credibility.
Isn’t the aim of the Unification Church contained in their name? So, if ‘the church’ won’t come to you, you slip in and become a part of ‘the church’. I say the possibility is real enough to warrant contacting IVP–as high up as you need to go–ASAP. Ideally, they need your blog itself with all of its links to search this out.
(I wonder if he’d refuse THEIR emails?)
Uh oh! I see a new thread: IVP Response to Moonie Allegations.
Warren –
Thank you for your post, and your investigation. I also agree that it is certainly acceptable for those of the evangelical Christian faith to seek help outside of that faith, but I think they need to know the truth about the affiliations of whom they consult, if they are being led to believe it is consistent with their traditions.
Mr. Cohen seems to have caught on that you know what’s going on (and thus, the returned email)…and to be frank, I see him as taking advantage of a vulnerable population…why? His methods are not proven (or substantiated) to help, he “certifies” his own type of “coach” (no objectivity there, or qualifications), he makes claims without substantiation all the time (and plasters them all over the media, and now he is apparently telling falsehoods about his affiliations.
He gives all therapists a bad name. Here I thought Dr. Phil had that role locked in…guess not.
Thanks again for bringing this to light. People deserve honest representations.
I am amazed that Intervarsity Press would print this book. Intervarsity grew out of the campus for Christ movement and focused on books that made a case for Christianity. Mr. Cohen makes a case for himself and elevates change in sexuality to a fruit of the spirit. This book is a blight on their catalog. I will need to evaluate every book coming from them to see if it is even a remotely Christian title. Thanks for this information.