Only the gay die young? Part 8 – Loose ends

I have read the Camerons replies to me in this ongoing discussion and have only a few more things to say.

Regarding Paul Cameron’s letter, I have very little to say. It does not appear to me that he really addressed any of my critiques. Instead, he convinced me that he has his mind made up about those who lead as he put it “parasitic lives.” He had a lot to say about his two quests in life, one being the public health consequences of second hand smoke and the other being the menace of what you could call second-hand-gay (we are all doomed because a small percentage of people are attracted to the same sex). If that doesn’t make sense, you’ll have to read his letter to me – but then again, that might not help either.

Kirk Cameron’s note was more substantial but I still need to see their data before I will comment more on the Denmark component of their study. Kirk Cameron says the paper is in peer review and so he cannot make the data available. When (if) the study is published, then I will review it further. He had various replies to Dr. Frisch’s critiques as well, none of which were especially convincing to me. As I read through the letter, it seemed like some fast dancing was going on. Here are examples:

As I will explain, you have apparently misread or misunderstood aspects of our methodology. Further, the ‘whole story’ about our research is not fully contained in the EPA paper, but rather in a series of separate, but related articles, each addressing a slightly different topic. Be that as it may, I do find it a bit of a double standard that you would implicitly criticize our use of the media and internet as a forum for dissemination of new information, when your blogsite is not, as far as I can tell, subject to any scholarly oversight (beside your own).

Ok, so I am supposed to read your mind? You have bits and pieces of justifications in other papers but since I don’t have them I can’t know what you intend. And Kirk compares a blog to a news release?

Yes, our estimates of homosexual longevity are preliminary and may change with additional data. But are they necessarily false or unreliable? No.

So when the news releases say dogmatically straights outlive gays by 20 years, this is “dissemination of new information?” So which is it? New information or preliminary data?

Kirk C. spends much time attempting to make an analogy (benchmark) between estimates of longevity for the general population and estimates for gays. However, one can take a representative sample of a known population, but using the same methods with an unknown population may not lead to the same results. I am not convinced that he has properly sampled homosexuals (or their deaths) in order to satisfy the assumptions needed to make the analogy reasonable.

And then there is this deflection:

Plus, there is the issue of nonrespondents. For the Canadian study this was relatively low — around 20% — but clearly still large enough to dramatically change the prevalence estimates were non-response correlated with a concealed homosexual orientation. This did not prevent Statistics Canada from asserting publicly that only 1.7% of the Canadian population was bisexual or homosexual. Were they professionally negligent in doing so? And what about the research teams from Great Britain, France, and the U.S. that have also reported low estimates of homosexual prevalence despite even larger refusal rates? Are you also criticizing them in the same vein, or is it only us in whom you have no confidence?

Statistics Canada nor have other researchers made something out of their numbers beyond the estimates of prevalence. The Camerons have read into what is essentially a black box and promoted their guesses in the press as facts. I personally don’t care what the facts turn out to be. However, I get the feeling that the Camerons do.

Unless something else comes up, this is probably part last.

7 thoughts on “Only the gay die young? Part 8 – Loose ends”

  1. If, for instannce, on were to type the terms Cameron and “second hand smoke” into the search engine Google Scholar [] you do find one study that others reference by a “Paul Cameron and Donald Robertson”

    A study by Paul Cameron and Donald Robertson indicated that children who are subjected to tobacco smoke in their homes have a greater prevalence of acute…..

    That study is:

    P Cameron, D Robertson – J Appl Psychol, 1973 Effect of home environment tobacco smoke on family health.

    That is not the 1969 that Cameron himself stated and I cannot determine if that is actually our Paul Cameron. Clicking on his name in Entrez PubMed you get a host of other articles, 156 in total, not all of which appear to be in our Paul Cameron’s perview.

    Search in Etrez PubMed on P Cameron as an author and set output at “200” and order by date and you do see our P Cameron’s early articles which are centered upon “sex.” Ah, there is this article:

    Cameron P, Kostin JS, Zaks JM, Wolfe JH, Tighe G, Oselett B, Stocker R, Winton J.; The health of smokers’ and nonsmokers’ children. J Allergy. 1969 Jun;43(6):336-41.

    I don’t know if that is him published in the Journal of Gerontology, and Gerontology; but I would guess not or he would have claimed that research. There is this stand-alone article by a P Cameron on children and smoking:

    Cameron P. Second-hand tobacco smoke: children’s reactions. J Sch Health. 1972 May;42(5):280-4. No abstract available. PMID: 4483158

    Thereafter Cameron’s apparent works concerning homosexuality published in [primarily in vanity journal, Psychological Reports]include:

    Cameron P. Homosexual molestation of children/sexual interaction of teacher and pupil. Psychol Rep. 1985 Dec;57(3 Pt 2):1227-36. PMID: 4095235

    Cameron P, Proctor K, Coburn W Jr, Forde N, Larson H, Cameron K. Child molestation and homosexuality. Psychol Rep. 1986 Feb;58(1):327-37. PMID: 3961077

    Cameron P. Corrected statistical analysis suggests casual transmission of AIDS in the African study on the Centers for Disease Control. Psychol Rep. 1987 Feb;60(1):177-8. No abstract available. PMID: 3562718

    Cameron P. HIV seroconversion and homosexual men. CMAJ. 1987 Apr 1;136(7):689-90. PMID: 3644693

    Cameron P, Cameron K, Proctor K. Homosexuals in the Armed Forces. Psychol Rep. 1988 Feb;62(1):211-9. No abstract available. PMID: 3363059

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Did the American Psychological Association misrepresent scientific material to the US Supreme Court? Psychol Rep. 1988 Aug;63(1):255-70. PMID: 3212128

    Cameron P, Cameron K, Proctor K. Effect of homosexuality upon public health and social order. Psychol Rep. 1989 Jun;64(3 Pt 2):1167-79. PMID: 2762461

    Cameron P. Sexual behaviour of men. BMJ. 1989 Aug 26;299(6698):568-9. No abstract available. PMID: 2507078

    Cameron P, Playfair WL. AIDS–intervention works; “education” is questionable. Psychol Rep. 1991 Apr;68(2):467-70. PMID: 1862178

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Homosexual parents. Adolescence. 1996 Winter;31(124):757-76. PMID: 8970651

    Cameron P, Cameron K, Landess T. Errors by the American Psychiatric Association, the American Psychological Association, and the National Educational, Association in representing homosexuality in amicus briefs about Amendment 2 to the U.S. Supreme Court. Psychol Rep. 1996 Oct;79(2):383-404. Review. PMID: 8909060

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Do homosexual teachers pose a risk to pupils? J Psychol. 1996 Nov;130(6):603-13. PMID: 9005252

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Did the APA misrepresent the scientific literature to courts in support of homosexual custody? J Psychol. 1997 May;131(3):313-32. PMID: 9153794

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Homosexual parents: a comparative forensic study of character and harms to children. Psychol Rep. 1998 Jun;82(3 Pt 2):1155-91. PMID: 9709522

    Cameron P, Cameron K, Playfair WL. Does homosexual activity shorten life? Psychol Rep. 1998 Dec;83(3 Pt 1):847-66. PMID: 9923159

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Abstinence and safer sex among adolescents. JAMA. 1999 Apr 28;281(16):1485-6; author reply 1487. PMID: 10227307

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Homosexual parents: why appeals cases approximate the “gold standard” for science–a reply to Duncan. Psychol Rep. 1999 Jun;84(3 Pt 1):793-802. PMID: 10408202

    Cameron P. Homosexual parents: testing “common sense”–a literature review emphasizing the Golombok and Tasker longitudinal study of lesbians’ children. Psychol Rep. 1999 Aug;85(1):282-322. PMID: 10575993

    Cameron P, Cameron K, Landess T. Green, Mandel, Hotvedt, Gray, and Smith’s study of 50 lesbian mothers and their children: inconsistencies in four published reports of the data. Psychol Rep. 2001 Jun;88(3 Pt 2):1223-34. PMID: 11597080

    Cameron P. Do homosexual teachers account for about half of news stories of molestations of pupils? A Boston Globe replication. Psychol Rep. 2002 Feb;90(1):173-4. PMID: 11898978

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Children of homosexual parents report childhood difficulties. Psychol Rep. 2002 Feb;90(1):71-82. PMID: 11899016

    Cameron P. Homosexual partnerships and homosexual longevity: a replication. Psychol Rep. 2002 Oct;91(2):671-8. PMID: 12416862

    Cameron P, Cameron K. What proportion of heterosexuals is ex-homosexual? Psychol Rep. 2002 Dec;91(3 Pt 2):1087-97. PMID: 12585518

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Psychology of the scientist: LXXXV. Research on homosexuality: a response to Schumm (and Herek). Psychol Rep. 2003 Feb;92(1):259-74. PMID: 12674293

    Cameron P. Homosexual parents in British custody appeals. Psychol Rep. 2003 Apr;92(2):379-86. PMID: 12785615

    Cameron P. Domestic violence among homosexual partners. Psychol Rep. 2003 Oct;93(2):410-6. PMID: 14650663

    Cameron P. Molestations by homosexual foster parents: newspaper accounts vs official records. Psychol Rep. 2003 Dec;93(3 Pt 1):793-802. PMID: 14723445

    Cameron P, Harris DW. Homosexual parents in custody disputes: a thousand child-years exposure. Psychol Rep. 2003 Dec;93(3 Pt 2):1173-94. PMID: 14765589

    Cameron P. Numbers of homosexual parents living with their children. Psychol Rep. 2004 Feb;94(1):179-88. PMID: 15077762

    Cameron P. Child molestations by homosexual foster parents: Illinois, 1997–2002. Psychol Rep. 2005 Feb;96(1):227-30. Erratum in: Psychol Rep. 2005 Feb;96(1):2. PMID: 15825933

    Cameron P. Are over a third of foster parent molestations homosexual? Psychol Rep. 2005 Apr;96(2):275-98. PMID: 15941101

    Cameron P. Oddities in Kirkpatrick, et al.’s study of children of lesbian mothers. Psychol Rep. 2005 Apr;96(2):397-407. PMID: 15941115

    Cameron P, Cameron K. Gay obituaries closely track officially reported deaths from AIDS. Psychol Rep. 2005 Jun;96(3 Pt 1):693-7. PMID: 16050624

    Cameron P, Landess T, Cameron K. Homosexual sex as harmful as drug abuse, prostitution, or smoking. Psychol Rep. 2005 Jun;96(3 Pt 2):915-61. PMID: 16173359

    Cameron P. Children of homosexuals and transsexuals more apt to be homosexual. J Biosoc Sci. 2006 May;38(3):413-8. Erratum in: J Biosoc Sci. 2007 Mar;39(2):317. PMID: 16613625

    Most all of which are published in the Ammons Scientific journal Psychological Reports. BTW – search Google Scholar for “Psychol Rep” & homosexual OR gay OR homosexuality OR lesbian and you get 655 returns…. 11 more and we’ll have the Apocalypse!

  2. Can anyone substantiate Paul Cameron’s claims regarding his studies of passive smoke?

  3. Careful now, we live in a world Paul Cameron created. He gave it to us, and he can take it away.

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