The delegates continued tweaking the judiciary and spent much time on details of state powers.
Influences on the Delegates
The delegates did not refer to other nations or refer to specific influences today.
I want to point out one exchange initiated by the delegates from South Carolina. On the discussion of extradition between states, Colonel Pinckney wanted to include runaway slaves. Article XV reads:
ARTICLE XV.
Any person charged with treason, felony or high misdemeanor in any State, who shall flee from justice, and shall be found in any other State, shall, on demand of the Executive power of the State from which he fled, be delivered up and removed to the State having jurisdiction of the offence. General PINCKNEY was not satisfied with it. He seemed to wish some provision should be included in favor of property in slaves.
On the question on Article 14, —
New Hampshire, Massachusetts, Connecticut, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, aye, — 9; South Carolina, no, — 1; Georgia, divided.
Article 15 being then taken up, the words, “high misdemeanor,” were struck out, and the words, “other crime,” inserted, in order to comprehend all proper cases; it being doubtful whether “high misdemeanor” had not a technical meaning too limited. Mr. BUTLER and Mr. PINCKNEY moved to require “fugitive slaves and servants to be delivered up like criminals.” Mr. WILSON. This would oblige the Executive of the State to do it at the public expense. Mr. SHERMAN saw no more propriety in the public seizing and surrendering a slave or servant than a horse. Mr. BUTLER withdrew his proposition, in order that some particular provision might be made, apart from this article.
Article 15, as amended, was then agreed to, nem. con.
After Pinckney couldn’t get a motion attached to Article XIV, he and Butler moved to add their fugitive slave clause. However, it was not added but Butler saved it for later.
1787 Constitutional Convention Series
To read my series examining the proceedings of the Constitution Convention, click here. In this series, I am writing about any obvious influences on the development of the Constitution which were mentioned by the delegates to the Convention. Specifically, I am testing David Barton’s claim that “every clause” of the Constitution is based on biblical principles. Thus far, I have found nothing supporting the claim. However, stay tuned, the series will run until mid-September. Constitutional Convention Series (click the link)
To follow on social media, click the following links: Facebook (blog posts and news) Facebook (Getting Jefferson Right – history news) Twitter
UPDATE: A video of the press conference and follow up Q & A is here.
I watched the video of the press conference. Some of it I couldn’t hear due to audio problems.
What Should We Do?
Generally, the suggestions from the panel were what one might expect from a group of clergy: pray, fast, trust God. Several Trump supporters were there but Trump’s mixed messages and hurtful actions were not called out (thinking specifically of the Arpaio pardon and his ambiguous reaction to Charlottesville). On the other hand, several said the job to bring reconciliation wasn’t Trump’s but the church’s job.
In response to a CBN reporter’s question, Bishop Harry Jackson said the concrete steps suggested by the panel are a fast, a call to prayer for 40 days starting tomorrow, an affirmation of the Justice Declaration written by Prison Fellowship, and rallies in 25 cities. Alveda King added that the committee wants to educate the public that America repented for lynchings and slavery via Congress.
On balance, the panel favored taking the monuments down. I agree.
The World Magazine report asked Trump supporters how they felt about his response to Charlottesville. Day Gardiner who sits on Trump’s diversity council said Trump loves all people and blamed “an entity” who is intent on demolishing Trump’s work. She believes he’s “on track.” Apparently Ms. Gardner has no concerns worth mentioning.
Frank Amedia the head of something called POTUS Shield took the “righteous left” to task for complaining about Trump.
None of them had anything to say about Trump’s statements or his pardon of Joe Arpaio.
What Was Missing?
Over and over the leaders declared that only God could heal racism. While I believe in the power of faith, I also know that the racist believes that the Christian God is on his side. The League of the South’s Michael Hill thanked God for their successes at Charlottesville. The racist and the anti-racist both claim Christianity. This must be confronted by Christian leaders. While they all condemned racism, I believe they also need to confront the racist theology in specific terms.
As I listened, I also wondered about how people of other religions or no religion fit in. If healing racism in America requires prayer and fasting to the Christian God, then what part do non-Christians play? I don’t think a broad movement can be led by calling on people to participate in religious dogma they don’t believe in. I don’t know if this exclusivity is a side effect of Christian nationalism but it seemed exclusionary even at the same time some of the rhetoric embraced inclusion.
Perhaps, these leaders were more correct when they addressed their comments to each other. In other words, they were right to criticize racism in Christianity. My reaction to listening to this 2 hour presser is to hope the good intentions lead to change in the church. I don’t think the church is ready to lead the nation in some political way. If these folks can’t even criticize Trump’s pardon of Joe Arpaio (as Martin Luther King, Jr. called out Bull Connor and police brutality in his Birmingham jail letter), then they are not ready to lead a broad coalition toward equality and justice.
At least, that’s my opinion. I could be wrong. I hope for better.
(Original post)
This morning at 9:30am EDT at the National Press Club, The Reconciled Church Initiative will hold a press conference on “The Church’s Role After Charlottesville.” The event will be webcast live on the organization’s website.
Most Influential Pastors in America
The press conference follows a meeting of what Morris called “some of the most influential pastors in America.” This meeting was held on August 21 in Los Angeles. Listen to Morris describe the meeting during the first three minutes of this August 19 sermon:
Transcript:
Alright before we, before I get to the message, I wanna make a couple of comments about what’s going on in our nation right now. We really need to pray uh, for our nation. Because there’s an incredible attack of the enemy against us. I spent over an hour on the phone this last weeken- week, with pastors, Christian leaders, Senators, uh, about what we could do in our nation right now. Monday, I’ll be with um, some of the most influential pastors in America. We’ve kind of called an emergency meeting. And so I’ll fly to Los Angeles actually and Monday morning and fly back Monday night. And we’ll spend the day in prayer and talk about how we, as pastors of some of the largest churches in America, how – what we can do to help, uh, our nation right now.
But, I want, I think it’s time for us to take a stand. And I think it’s time for us to make it clear. (applause) As Christians. As Christians, we need, to make it clear, so, so Imma gonna make it clear for ya, alright? The KKK, white supremacy and racism are straight from the pit of hell. They are from the pit of hell. There is no place for racism in Christianity. None. God created us equal when he created Adam and Eve he creates us one and then he does another oneness in Christ. But we are no better than someone else and what’s going on right now in our country is, is the Enemy attacking and we need to stand up. And we need to say something about it. So, I want us to take a moment and pray for our nation. Will ya, will you agree with me?
So Lord we come to ya, as your sons and your daughters and God we say to you, ‘we need your help’. Lord only you can do it Only you can fix it. And you told us what the answer is and that is to love God with all your heart, mind, soul and strength. And love your neighbor as yourself. And so Lord I pray for revival in this country. I pray God what Satan means for evil, you will turn it for good. And I pray God the hatred and the racism that has been present for years will end, with this generation,Am that we will take a stand and we will end it in the name and the power and the blood of the Lord Jesus Christ. Amen and amen.”
Morris described what happened at the August 21 meeting in his Saturday sermon on the 26th. The answer? Love and prayer.
Transcript:
I just want to give you an update because many of you were praying. Uh, about fifty pastors from very influential churches in America came together this last week to talk about the problem of racism in America. And, um, there were about a third white pastors, about a third black pastors, about a third, uh, Hispanic and Asian. Of that third of Hispanic and Asian, about two-thirds of those were, uh, Hispanic; about a third Asian. Uh, but we had a tremendous prayer time before the Lord. We talked. We talked about what the church can do. And um, there was just, uh, there was one main conclusion. And that is that racism is, evil, and we need to call it evil and we need to preach love. (applause) So, I just want you to know that I am committed to continue to take a national stand in this area. And so, continue to pray for us. I believe, obviously, the pastors and the body of Christ, we have the answer to this. And I, I believe that God could bring a healing to this problem in this generation. And that’s what we’re praying for.
The answer? Call racism evil and preach love.
Morris and the “influential pastors in America” could start with themselves and Trump’s evangelical advisory board. Although it would be a powerful statement, I have a hunch Trump’s pardon of Joe Arpaio won’t come up at today’s presser. I hope they prove me wrong.
The delegates voted to make the president commander chief of the militia when called to defend the nation. The delegates fine-tuned the judiciary today.
Influences on the Delegates
Britain again was the model for the question of removing judges for an offense.
Mr. GOUVERNEUR MORRIS thought it a contradiction in terms, to say, that the Judges should hold their offices during good behaviour, and yet be removeable without a trial. Besides, it was fundamentally wrong to subject judges to so arbitrary an authority. Mr. SHERMAN saw no contradiction or impropriety, if this were made a part of the constitutional regulation of the Judiciary establishment. He observed, that a like provision was contained in the British statutes. Mr. RUTLEDGE. If the Supreme Court is to judge between the United States and particular States, this alone is an insuperable objection to the motion. Mr. WILSON considered such a provision in the British Government as less dangerous than here; the House of Lords and House of Commons being less likely to concur on the same occasions. Chief Justice Holt, he remarked, had successively offended, by his independent conduct, both Houses of Parliament. Had this happened at the same time, he would have been ousted. The Judges would be in a bad situation, if made to depend on any gust of faction which might prevail in the two branches of our Government.
1787 Constitutional Convention Series
To read my series examining the proceedings of the Constitution Convention, click here. In this series, I am writing about any obvious influences on the development of the Constitution which were mentioned by the delegates to the Convention. Specifically, I am testing David Barton’s claim that “every clause” of the Constitution is based on biblical principles. Thus far, I have found nothing supporting the claim. However, stay tuned, the series will run until mid-September. Constitutional Convention Series (click the link)
To follow on social media, click the following links: Facebook (blog posts and news) Facebook (Getting Jefferson Right – history news) Twitter
The first screen from Exit: The Appeal of Suicide
I wrote about this movie in late July when the star of Exit: The Appeal of Suicide Ray Comfort appeared on the David Barton’s Wallbuilders Live show. I didn’t think highly of what they had to say about depression at the time but withheld judgment about the movie because I hadn’t seen it. I watched it recently and cannot recommend it. On balance, I don’t believe it is a helpful movie about suicide or something I can recommend for those who might be contemplating suicide.
The first thing a viewer sees is the image above. The movie never identifies the “many experts” or provides any evidence for their alleged belief that the vast majority of cases aren’t organic. In fact, some cases are probably not organic but the cutting edge of research into depression involves genetics, neuroscience and adaptation. The adaptation aspect of the picture does involve experience but the prevailing view is that depression is the result of many factors operating differently for different people (source). For many people, depression arises without warning or environmental trigger.
However, for the most part, Comfort and crew ignore all of that. Comfort converses with several depressed college students and eventually turns the conversation to their sinfulness in an effort to get them to convert to his approach to Christianity. I say “his approach” because a couple of the students seemed to have some religious background. However, they didn’t answer Comfort’s questions according to his liking and he persisted in pressing for a conversion.
I had planned to review this movie more extensively. However, after watching it, I don’t see the point. Comfort’s answer to depression and suicide is for the depressed person to get saved. If depressed Christians watched this movie, I don’t know what they would come away with. I suspect many Christians watching this movie will question their faith at just the time they need it. I can’t see how that would be helpful.
An Evangelism Tool
In the end, this movie is an evangelism tool. Comfort wants to make converts and he has used depression and suicide to set the stage for his evangelism pitch. In the end, Comfort and crew offer disclaimers and offer an option to call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline (800-273-8255). However, the message had already been made very clear. The answer for depression is to become a Christian the Ray Comfort way.
I suspect Comfort and his mates mean well. They don’t want people to hurt or be depressed and I suspect they really believe that Christian salvation is required to be free of depression. However, this is an inadequate assessment of the situation.
Although depression is multi-faceted and for some might be improved by making a spiritual commitment, this is not the case for many others. Devout Christians experience depression without any obvious triggers. For some, their moods simply do not follow a normal course of regulation. Their lows are too low and/or their highs too high. While Christian salvation might help them feel more grounded and connect them to the supernatural, it won’t touch the causes of their mood disorder. Having Christians tell them to pray harder or accept Christ more sincerely is unhelpful and may indeed cause such despair that the efforts become harmful.
Because this movie so badly misses the mark, I can’t recommend it.
