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	Comments on: Institute on the Constitution: The American View or the Confederate View?	</title>
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	<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/</link>
	<description>A [retired] college psychology professor&#039;s observations about public policy, mental health, sexual identity, and religious issues</description>
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		<title>
		By: oft		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-95708</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[oft]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2018 03:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com/?p=15086#comment-95708</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94513&quot;&gt;Jon Rowe&lt;/a&gt;.

&quot;The writings of the framers contradict the assumption they rejected biblical inerrancy.&quot;
Jon : LOL.
&quot;&quot;To which I may now add, that the[re are] several Things in the old Testament impossible to be given by divine Inspiration, such as the Approbation ascrib&#039;d to the Angel of the Lord, of that abominably wicked and detestable Action of Jael the Wife of Heber the Kenite. If the rest of the Book were like that, I should rather suppose it given by Inspiration from another Quarter, and renounce the whole.&quot;
&#8211; Ben Franklin.&quot;
Notice at the top, Jon wrote &quot;framers&quot; then posted an opinion by one man. Thank God framers includes more than one man.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94513">Jon Rowe</a>.</p>
<p>&#8220;The writings of the framers contradict the assumption they rejected biblical inerrancy.&#8221;<br />
Jon : LOL.<br />
&#8220;&#8221;To which I may now add, that the[re are] several Things in the old Testament impossible to be given by divine Inspiration, such as the Approbation ascrib&#8217;d to the Angel of the Lord, of that abominably wicked and detestable Action of Jael the Wife of Heber the Kenite. If the rest of the Book were like that, I should rather suppose it given by Inspiration from another Quarter, and renounce the whole.&#8221;<br />
&#8211; Ben Franklin.&#8221;<br />
Notice at the top, Jon wrote &#8220;framers&#8221; then posted an opinion by one man. Thank God framers includes more than one man.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Jon Rowe		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-95709</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Jon Rowe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2018 03:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com/?p=15086#comment-95709</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-95567&quot;&gt;oft&lt;/a&gt;.

&quot;The framers said the context of religion is to the states and the states formed Christianity, especially Virginia, where TJ established Christianity over other false religions:...&quot;
And Jefferson apparently understood the VA Statute that he authored differently than OFT does:
-- The bill for establishing religious freedom, the principles of which had, to a certain degree, been enacted before, I had drawn in all the latitude of reason and right. It still met with opposition; but, with some mutilations in the preamble, it was finally passed; and a singular proposition proved that its protection of opinion was meant to be universal. Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed, by inserting the word &quot;Jesus Christ,&quot; so that it should read, &quot;a departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;&quot; the insertion was rejected by a great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mahometan, the Hindoo, and Infidel of every denomination. --]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-95567">oft</a>.</p>
<p>&#8220;The framers said the context of religion is to the states and the states formed Christianity, especially Virginia, where TJ established Christianity over other false religions:&#8230;&#8221;<br />
And Jefferson apparently understood the VA Statute that he authored differently than OFT does:<br />
&#8212; The bill for establishing religious freedom, the principles of which had, to a certain degree, been enacted before, I had drawn in all the latitude of reason and right. It still met with opposition; but, with some mutilations in the preamble, it was finally passed; and a singular proposition proved that its protection of opinion was meant to be universal. Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed, by inserting the word &#8220;Jesus Christ,&#8221; so that it should read, &#8220;a departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;&#8221; the insertion was rejected by a great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mahometan, the Hindoo, and Infidel of every denomination. &#8212;</p>
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		<title>
		By: bman		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-95707</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[bman]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2018 03:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com/?p=15086#comment-95707</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94511&quot;&gt;Jon Rowe&lt;/a&gt;.

&lt;blockquote&gt;
Jon: &quot;There was nothing in the founding scheme that guaranteed the states would promote &quot;Christianity&quot; to the exclusion of other religions in the &quot;religio[n] is left to the states&quot; model.&quot;
bman: &quot;That seems correct since religion was left to the states.&quot;
------
&lt;/blockquote&gt;
Some additional clarification.
I understood  your post to mean,  &quot;There was nothing in the founding scheme that guaranteed the states would [continue to promote] Christianity to the exclusion of other religions.&quot;
The founders certainly knew the state governments to be distinctively Christian at the time of the 1787 convention,  and had every reason to think they would remain so for the foreseeable future.
Virtually every state had a distinctively Christian government at the time, which can be largely verified by the Conservapedia article on &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.conservapedia.com/Original_State_Constitutions&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt; Original State Constitutions&lt;/a&gt;.
As to the more distant future, John Adams and Benjamin Franklin thought  the government they formed would last until the people became morally corrupt.  As follows,
&lt;blockquote&gt;
Benjamin Franklin: &quot;....[I] believe farther that this [Constitutional government] is likely to be well administered for a course of years, and can only end in Despotism, as other forms have done before it, when the people shall become so corrupted as to need despotic Government, being incapable of any other.&quot;
John Adams:  &quot;Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.&quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
From that perspective, whoever defends Christian values in society effectively defends the American view of government in the same process.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94511">Jon Rowe</a>.</p>
<blockquote><p>
Jon: &#8220;There was nothing in the founding scheme that guaranteed the states would promote &#8220;Christianity&#8221; to the exclusion of other religions in the &#8220;religio[n] is left to the states&#8221; model.&#8221;<br />
bman: &#8220;That seems correct since religion was left to the states.&#8221;<br />
&#8212;&#8212;
</p></blockquote>
<p>Some additional clarification.<br />
I understood  your post to mean,  &#8220;There was nothing in the founding scheme that guaranteed the states would [continue to promote] Christianity to the exclusion of other religions.&#8221;<br />
The founders certainly knew the state governments to be distinctively Christian at the time of the 1787 convention,  and had every reason to think they would remain so for the foreseeable future.<br />
Virtually every state had a distinctively Christian government at the time, which can be largely verified by the Conservapedia article on <a href="http://www.conservapedia.com/Original_State_Constitutions" rel="nofollow"> Original State Constitutions</a>.<br />
As to the more distant future, John Adams and Benjamin Franklin thought  the government they formed would last until the people became morally corrupt.  As follows,</p>
<blockquote><p>
Benjamin Franklin: &#8220;&#8230;.[I] believe farther that this [Constitutional government] is likely to be well administered for a course of years, and can only end in Despotism, as other forms have done before it, when the people shall become so corrupted as to need despotic Government, being incapable of any other.&#8221;<br />
John Adams:  &#8220;Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>From that perspective, whoever defends Christian values in society effectively defends the American view of government in the same process.</p>
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			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: oft		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-95706</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[oft]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2018 03:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com/?p=15086#comment-95706</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94512&quot;&gt;Tom Van Dyke&lt;/a&gt;.

&quot;&quot;And Jefferson apparently understood the VA Statute that he authored differently than OFT does:
&#8211; The bill for establishing religious freedom, the principles of which had, to a certain degree, been enacted before, I had drawn in all the latitude of reason and right. It still met with opposition; but, with some mutilations in the preamble, it was finally passed; and a singular proposition proved that its protection of opinion was meant to be universal. Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed, by inserting the word &quot;Jesus Christ,&quot; so that it should read, &quot;a departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;&quot; the insertion was rejected by a great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mahometan, the Hindoo, and Infidel of every denomination. &#8211;&quot;&quot;
All this says is free exercise is for all.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94512">Tom Van Dyke</a>.</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8221;And Jefferson apparently understood the VA Statute that he authored differently than OFT does:<br />
&#8211; The bill for establishing religious freedom, the principles of which had, to a certain degree, been enacted before, I had drawn in all the latitude of reason and right. It still met with opposition; but, with some mutilations in the preamble, it was finally passed; and a singular proposition proved that its protection of opinion was meant to be universal. Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed, by inserting the word &#8220;Jesus Christ,&#8221; so that it should read, &#8220;a departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;&#8221; the insertion was rejected by a great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mahometan, the Hindoo, and Infidel of every denomination. &#8211;&#8221;&#8221;<br />
All this says is free exercise is for all.</p>
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			</item>
		<item>
		<title>
		By: oft		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-95710</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[oft]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 May 2018 03:45:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com/?p=15086#comment-95710</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94512&quot;&gt;Tom Van Dyke&lt;/a&gt;.

TVD,
They always used classical language, not generic language. Where is the quote GW specifically mentioned Unitarian chaplains?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://wthrockmorton.com/2013/08/13/institute-on-the-constitution-the-american-view-or-the-confederate-view/#comment-94512">Tom Van Dyke</a>.</p>
<p>TVD,<br />
They always used classical language, not generic language. Where is the quote GW specifically mentioned Unitarian chaplains?</p>
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