Comments on: Evergreen Celebrates the Nobleman

By: StraightGrandmother

StraightGrandmother — Wed, 30 May 2018 20:01:14 +0000

@Jere my Schwab, I'm confused. Which is it? This-

After two-years of trying to embrace the "gay" identity I repented and came back to Christ.

Or this-

I spent 12 years in the lifestyle. For me, the biggest risk (two-years ago) was NOT changing and not being able to stop the acting-out which had controlled and ruined my life for 12 years.

By: Michael Bussee

Michael Bussee — Wed, 30 May 2018 20:01:13 +0000

You are right in your observation that Exodus uses the “rhetoric of congruence.” Earlier this year, they claimed that congruence is their “mission, period” — but as you pointed out, their promotion of reparative therapy materials seems to indicate otherwise.

“Exodus believes the opposite of homosexuality is not heterosexuality. It is holiness. We promote the belief that one can live a life that is congruent with their faith. That is our “mission – period.” ~ Jeff Buchanan, Christian Post, 3/22/11

By: StraightGrandmother

StraightGrandmother — Wed, 30 May 2018 20:01:13 +0000

Jeremy Schwab, what do yo think would happen to you, or perhaps I should say, what would you be like if you never attended any group meetings regarding SSA, ever again? If it works so well why do you keep going? Thank you.

By: F Young

F Young — Wed, 30 May 2018 20:01:13 +0000

“Congruence is mostly be understood as congruence between one’s values and one’s life. Which is achieved either by changing one’s values (according to one’s life) or changing one’s life (according to one’s values).”

Maybe in theory, but, in practice, it seems to me that psychologists and religious counselors focus only on one approach, changing one’s sexual behaviour according to one’s religion.
Nobody seems to offer counselling to change one’s religion or faith according to one’s sexual orientation. Why is that? Is it unethical? Shouldn’t psychologists give primacy to the client’s nature rather than to society’s norms? It seems that religion always has primacy.

By: Jeremy Schwab

Jeremy Schwab — Wed, 30 May 2018 20:01:13 +0000

Ok, I do want to clarify.
I’m NOT trying to say that Exodus and Courage are “not helpful” in reducing SSA.
MOST of what they both teach is aligned with what I have found helpful.
I AM very grateful for their work and their ministries even though I disagree with both of them on some things.
The areas I disagree with them on are the one’s Warren documents in this article (congruence of faith vs. change therapy). I take the exact Opposite view of Warren, Exodus, and many of my friends in Courage.
I value congruence of faith very highly, but I feel I can take care of that for myself. The greatest risk for me is not that I MIGHT over-hear someone’s strange theological views. I can turn a TV and hear that. It is also not that I MIGHT be tempted to have SSA thoughts or to act-out. I spent 12 years in the lifestyle. For me, the biggest risk (two-years ago) was NOT changing and not being able to stop the acting-out which had controlled and ruined my life for 12 years.
I really don’t feel like there is THAT much in-congruence. These experiential weekends are NOT religious retreats. They do NOT teach any theological content so it really doesn’t matter if they have people from different religious involved.
The company I work for hires people of different religions. Even though our CEO is a Christian, there is not a definitely requirement to be a Christian to work at our (Fortune 500) corporation. Should I quit my job?