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	Comments on: Psychoanalytic theory and the etiology of homosexuality: What does research say?	</title>
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	<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/</link>
	<description>A [retired] college psychology professor&#039;s observations about public policy, mental health, sexual identity, and religious issues</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2008 20:26:05 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Lynn David		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66754</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lynn David]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2008 20:26:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66754</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I came here only after Dr T  referenced this post in a more recent post (22Aug2008) and read Drowssap&#039;s post &lt;a href=&quot;//2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-68289&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;#68289&lt;/a&gt;.  I&#039;d like to clear something up, I had a great and loving family life.   I could not have asked for any two better parents.   My father was neither distant nor cold but warm and even affectionate with me (appropriately so to stop any thoughts to the contrary).   At the same time the he imparted the requisite &quot;manly skills&quot; to me by sharing his work (in construction) and play (fishing, hunting and even boxing), and I gladly/happily shared in them.   Drowssap is perhaps remembering some talk on here about some of the physical attacks on my person from others when I was in my early teens.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I came here only after Dr T  referenced this post in a more recent post (22Aug2008) and read Drowssap&#8217;s post <a href="//2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-68289" rel="nofollow">#68289</a>.  I&#8217;d like to clear something up, I had a great and loving family life.   I could not have asked for any two better parents.   My father was neither distant nor cold but warm and even affectionate with me (appropriately so to stop any thoughts to the contrary).   At the same time the he imparted the requisite &#8220;manly skills&#8221; to me by sharing his work (in construction) and play (fishing, hunting and even boxing), and I gladly/happily shared in them.   Drowssap is perhaps remembering some talk on here about some of the physical attacks on my person from others when I was in my early teens.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Ann		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66753</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Ann]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 17:46:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66753</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Thank you very much for the detailed explanation of the word &quot;science&quot; - I understand the meaning of it better now.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you very much for the detailed explanation of the word &#8220;science&#8221; &#8211; I understand the meaning of it better now.</p>
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		<title>
		By: ken		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66752</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ken]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 06:46:55 +0000</pubDate>
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					<description><![CDATA[Ann asked in post 69071:



&lt;i&gt;When the word “science” is used in reference to validating or invalidating certain facts regarding homosexuality - what exactly does the word mean?&lt;/i&gt;



Science means &quot;the study of nature.&quot;



&lt;i&gt;Is it medical, biology, research, psychology, surveys, etc.?&lt;/i&gt;



Depends on the context.



&lt;i&gt;and if so, who determines what individual or individuals are selected?&lt;/i&gt;



The person in charge of the research.  Although, he or she may delegate that task to someone else.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ann asked in post 69071:</p>
<p><i>When the word “science” is used in reference to validating or invalidating certain facts regarding homosexuality &#8211; what exactly does the word mean?</i></p>
<p>Science means &#8220;the study of nature.&#8221;</p>
<p><i>Is it medical, biology, research, psychology, surveys, etc.?</i></p>
<p>Depends on the context.</p>
<p><i>and if so, who determines what individual or individuals are selected?</i></p>
<p>The person in charge of the research.  Although, he or she may delegate that task to someone else.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Timothy Kincaid		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66751</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Timothy Kincaid]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 06:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66751</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[ugh.. the REALM of guessing



Ann,



I hope that helped clarify]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ugh.. the REALM of guessing</p>
<p>Ann,</p>
<p>I hope that helped clarify</p>
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		<title>
		By: Timothy Kincaid		</title>
		<link>https://wthrockmorton.com/2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66750</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Timothy Kincaid]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Dec 2007 06:29:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2007/11/28/psychoanalytic-theory-and-the-etiology-of-homosexuality-what-does-research-say/#comment-66750</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Ann,



&quot;Science&quot; generally means knowledge based on systematic observation.  It must be both observable and empirical (ie testable).  All the different branches you listed can fall under this category.



Some sciences are more exact than others.  For example, we can accurately measure the temperature at which water boils.  Every gallon of water, every time.  Other are less exact and can only be discussed in terms of averages.



When &quot;science&quot; is used in terms of homosexuality, what that generally refers to is some sort of study of a sample of homosexual people - generally with a control group of heterosexual people - and an observation of characteristics.



Sometimes these are soft science studies - such as measurement of expressed attractions - and sometimes these are hard science studies - such as a measured response of brain size or activation.  Even in the hard science studies, because we are dealing with human responses and issues of identity and self-determination of attractions, such studies have to be weighed carefully.



Ultimately, one cannot say that &quot;science says&quot; anything about homosexuality until studies have been replicated with similar results.  But with enough repetition of results, some conclusions can be drawn.



Thus we can say pretty clearly that gay persons are more likely to be lefthanded than are straight persons, on average.  Not a very exact statement, but measurable, repeatable, and statistically significant.



On the other hand, some observations are seen that may not be readily repeated.  Much of the &quot;gay gene&quot; studies have suffered from inconclusive follow up studies.



Others seem to raise their heads from time to time but are not conclusive one way or another.  The fraternal order effect would be one of those.



For inconclusive studies, or those not yet repeated, one might say &quot;science suggests&quot;.



And others are based on methods so shoddy that they are laughable.  They are &quot;studies&quot; comparable to determining the country&#039;s favorite ice cream by asking your own kids.  Paul Cameron&#039;s &quot;research&quot; all falls into that category.



But nonetheless, the inclusion of &quot;science&quot; is a valuable distinction.  It is what takes the opinion out of the real of guessing and holds it up to light.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ann,</p>
<p>&#8220;Science&#8221; generally means knowledge based on systematic observation.  It must be both observable and empirical (ie testable).  All the different branches you listed can fall under this category.</p>
<p>Some sciences are more exact than others.  For example, we can accurately measure the temperature at which water boils.  Every gallon of water, every time.  Other are less exact and can only be discussed in terms of averages.</p>
<p>When &#8220;science&#8221; is used in terms of homosexuality, what that generally refers to is some sort of study of a sample of homosexual people &#8211; generally with a control group of heterosexual people &#8211; and an observation of characteristics.</p>
<p>Sometimes these are soft science studies &#8211; such as measurement of expressed attractions &#8211; and sometimes these are hard science studies &#8211; such as a measured response of brain size or activation.  Even in the hard science studies, because we are dealing with human responses and issues of identity and self-determination of attractions, such studies have to be weighed carefully.</p>
<p>Ultimately, one cannot say that &#8220;science says&#8221; anything about homosexuality until studies have been replicated with similar results.  But with enough repetition of results, some conclusions can be drawn.</p>
<p>Thus we can say pretty clearly that gay persons are more likely to be lefthanded than are straight persons, on average.  Not a very exact statement, but measurable, repeatable, and statistically significant.</p>
<p>On the other hand, some observations are seen that may not be readily repeated.  Much of the &#8220;gay gene&#8221; studies have suffered from inconclusive follow up studies.</p>
<p>Others seem to raise their heads from time to time but are not conclusive one way or another.  The fraternal order effect would be one of those.</p>
<p>For inconclusive studies, or those not yet repeated, one might say &#8220;science suggests&#8221;.</p>
<p>And others are based on methods so shoddy that they are laughable.  They are &#8220;studies&#8221; comparable to determining the country&#8217;s favorite ice cream by asking your own kids.  Paul Cameron&#8217;s &#8220;research&#8221; all falls into that category.</p>
<p>But nonetheless, the inclusion of &#8220;science&#8221; is a valuable distinction.  It is what takes the opinion out of the real of guessing and holds it up to light.</p>
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