So we have at UNC-Chapel Hill:

http://media.www.dailytarheel.com/media/storage/paper885/news/2007/09/11/University/Evangelists.Escorted.Off.Campus-2960602.shtml

http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/PamsHouseBlend/~3/155449214/showDiary.do

I agree with you – since suicide is a product of depression, it would only make sense that those groups more prone to depression would also be prone to suicide. I’m guessing that, given our society, gay people may indeed be more prone to depression than some other groups – While the environment for gay people, at least in this country, has gotten better, it still isn’t even quite up to the level of tolerant – so this may definitely be the case – but I don’t for sure.

It is true that they attempt because they now have further energy and no real ways of coping. However, the lawsuits have been in respect to the medication…and the warnings seem to have rested there.

The caution is not around maintaining vigilance during the period of medications (although this should be done by everyone) there are now warnings on the antidepressant medications as ordered by the FDA:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/03/health/03depress.html?ex=1189656000&en=04de4b163d99ab42&ei=5070

It is my understanding that youth who are medicated are more likely within the first few weeks to actually attempt and commit a suicide because as the medication begins to revive their energy they have not learned the skills to manage impulsive behavior as well as adults and thus are more likely in this beginning period to suicide. Isn’t the caution to maintain almost a hypervigilance during this priod and then afterwards the suicides decline again?

If gays are more prone to depression then that would increase their risk.

It seems that sometimes, people who are depressed simply are too hopeless, drained and have no energy to complete it. When medicated, it can give them energy to do so – which is why some medications now have warnings that they can increase the chances of suicide attempt.

There also does seem to be some inherent self-preservation in us…which is likely why a large portion of individuals who commit suicide, attempt to do so under the influence of a substance.

True, men do commit suicide more than women (but women attempt far more often…because of their methods, they are usually not as likely to “complete.”) Women are likely to use pills, etc…whereas men are much more likely to use a gun.

In general, I think we all agree that hopelessness and depression do lead to higher rates of suicide attempt. However, as gay youth are a consistently ignored part of the population that struggles – often silently – I applaud the Irish President for calling attention to the bullying that is often ignored and not addressed.

We do need to address the issue of suicide on a wide scale in many groups – elderly, etc…but taking a stand on at least one portion of the population is better than ignoring them, or taking no stand at all. It’s more than our president has done.

I don’t think its accurate to say “They are at risk if other indicators are present – drugs, white, male, access, protestant..” – I think its pretty clear that sexual orienation puts gay kids more at risk than others.

Your walking-into-a-gym analogy is a good one, but it shouldn’t mean we don’t identify high risk groups. The importance of identifying these groups is not to romanticize the act of suicide, but so those social networks that support these high risk groups can pay special attention to the needs of that group and address them. It would be nice if we were all dealt with in society as a whole group, but we are not – we are splintered and grouped into different social niches and clicks, with different resources at our disposal.

The only thing I think we’ve been able to determine regarding homosexuals, is that there seem to be some indication they are at greater risk than other groups – but the evidence doesn’t seem to be definitive – we cannot say they are NOT at higher risk than other groups though – which is not something I think you’re saying, but I wanted to make clear what it is we know and what we don’t know. And we don’t know that they aren’t at higher risk than other groups

I think you are starting to get the idea. Unfortunately, gays are not the group at highest risk or near highest risk. They are at risk if other indicators are present – drugs, white, male, access, protestant etc…. And yes, working on the underlying issues is what happens for those individuals.

I look at it this way, if I walked into a gymnasium filled with teenagers and I wanted to save anyone of them from suicide, my first question for selection would be – who is depressed? And whether they were gay or not – those are the kids I would focus on. Yes, some would be gay, some would not. Being gay is not the biggest nor the highest indicator or presenting risk factor where suicide is concerned.

I AM NOT saying that gay kids do not contemplate, attempt or commit suicide. They do. And yes, that needs to be looked at. But when someone presents “gay suicide stats” for the purpose of making intimidating (scaring others into action) – those stats are off and can contribute to an unneccesary (sp??) suicide (the child who also hears them). Just one – ONE – child’s life is worth saving. And the greatest number of suicides are being committed by other children who are depressed for a variety of reasons.

I am not anti-gay, nor ignoring the hardships of being young and gay or any of that. I’m just looking at numbers and who is a greatest risk. White, male, drugs/alcohol, access, protestant, plan, previous attempts etc… but girls commit suicide too, so do blacks, catholics etc… I’m not overlooking them either. And the greatest – greatest indicator we can look for instead of demographics is depression. And that includes so many more who need the same kind of attention.