I think Timothy’s link sounds like a more direct line than searching ‘affirmative’ under churches as I suggested earlier.

Thanks for your honesty and openness, BTW, and ‘welcome aboard!’… I see you’ve found us up on the current thread.

LOL! In the midst of the other advice, I don’t think I made it clear that THIS would also be a good place for you to ‘hang out’ and find fellowship while you’re deciding your next steps. I see on the current thread that you’ve already found your way to the SIT materials. I admire your tenacity and ‘follow through’.

(Warning: we actually tend to blog less on weekends so if things get quiet for a day or two, don’t worry. Things will pick up again come Monday.)

There is no reason why you cannot have a perfectly happy and normal life – full of love and commitment and satisfaction with the man of your dreams and a close relationship with God.

If you would like to talk to someone who is gay supportive but not dismissive of the Bible and God, please contact the pastor of one of the churches on this site:

http://www.gaychurch.org/Find_a_Church/foriegn_nations/australia.htm

Here’s some comments regarding all your replies and Eddy’s questions:

1). I never really did identify as gay when I was a kid. But as I grew up I realised that I was in denial about my attraction to other guys. Do I call myself gay? I don’t like to label myself as it always means something else to different people. But yeah I’m pretty sure I’m SSA or whatever you want to call it. I just can’t imagine being intimate with a girl, it feels weird and wrong.

2). Identifying as such is a problem for me as I’m a Christian. And all I ever heard all my life was that homosexuality was a perversion (that usually involved molesters, crazed lunatics and the like). But I know now it’s not that black and white. That might have been why I was in denial about it for so long, I didn’t see myself as some pervert.

Okay, sure, I’m not proud about the fact I’ve lusted and fantasized about other guys my age. That has conflicted with my Christian beliefs. But having come to grips with that and not being as – how do i say this – …randy and full of hormones as when I was a teenager, I am now at a crossroad.

I don’t see myself as a pervert, I don’t want to use other human beings just for their bodies. I want to be in a fulfilling relationship. But I feel like a freak at times, because this isn’t considered ‘normal’. And with all the bad role models and gay subculture that exists, I often wonder, is this where all gays are destined to go? Partying, drugs, sex, disease and superficiality?? This leads on to the next point below.

3). I feel alone in the world, I don’t know who trust about this. There are well meaning pastors who try and understand….but can never really do when they are heterosexual. There are other pastors who condemn the ‘lifestyle’ and the ‘choices’ made by these men and women who have ‘chosen’ to lead such an immoral path.

Then there’s the pro-gay groups who encourage the sexual liberation and encourage others to experiment. There are groups who try to cause doubt about the Bible and say that “all those ancients were doing all sorts of bad stuff, we can’t be sure what’s right and wrong in that book”. etc

I know that was showing extremes, but that’s what I encounter usually, though not always. I feel like someone should speak up in my church and raise this as an important issue….then I remember, only someone like myself who knows these feelings can speak up…..but I probably never will, as that would make people never trust me again. Maybe that’s another reason why I cry and hate myself, because I’m too afraid to speak up for all the other girls and guys suffering in silence like me.

What I’m going to say next may seem terrible or crazy, I dunno, but please understand.

I’ve sometimes felt it better when I was crying and filled with disgust, confusion and sadness. Maybe cause when I feel like that, for that space of time, I know I’m not going to get those other feelings of attraction to a guy. Like I’m not supposed to enjoy life and go about my day, as I’m a freak to others. I feel like the case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde, so many mixed feelings.

If any other readers do, please contact me via email.

1) It sounds like you identify as gay but you also are conflicted about society’s stereotypes of masculinity and feminity. So, do you think you identify as gay or would ‘different’ be a better word?

2) You really didn’t mention how or why ‘identifying as gay’ would be a problem. That’s a very important 2nd question. Why is that a problem for you? (your morals? your parents’? your community’s? the social stigma? fitting in with your friends? religious beliefs? dream of a family?) LOL! Don’t worry if it’s a little bit of this and a little bit of that but do try to determine what YOU believe. My gut feeling is that you shouldn’t make serious steps in either direction until you’ve answered that one.

3) That answer might lead you to the next one. What kind of help/support are you looking for? Ken and Ann both gave excellent suggestions. If you’re really not sure what you’re looking for, then sampling the available resources representing BOTH sides might be of some value. Hopefully, the internet has made finding those resources a whole lot easier. Under ‘churches’ you might search the word ‘affirming’ to find churches or groups that would help you accept your gay identity. Searching ‘ex-gay’ or “Exodus International” should help you if you feel you’re gay but it conflicts with your faith. (Our blog host, Dr. Throckmorton, is developing another form of therapy known as SIT–Sexual Identity Therapy. I don’t know if he knows anyone he could refer you to in ‘the land down under’ but it wouldn’t hurt to ask.)

My only caution to you when visiting either pro-gay or ex-gay groups is to be wary of group and peer pressure and persuasion. (That’s why it’s so important for you to have some sense of where you’re at before you go. When the day is done, you still have to be true to you and what you believe.)

Please also consider some organizations that are not exclusively gay – that way you can really experience all that you deserve to and then as you “sort things out”, you can start to see how you feel and more important – what you value and how you want to live.

But it would be nice to sort out my feelings. When I see many of my friends getting married, or getting into relationships I’m realising that it won’t be so easy for me.

Perhaps you should look for some gay organizations to join (i.e. political orgs, sports groups, charity orgs, support groups, churches, social groups etc), to meet other gays. If you live in a rural area, then you may wish to consider moving to a more urban area with a larger gay community.

Sorry, I didn’t mean to generalise. I was trying to explain that in different cultures the interaction between people of the the same sex is viewed differently. For example, when my family came to Australia, my mum wanted to walk arm in arm with her best friend (a woman). Yet that friend warned that they couldn’t do such a thing here in public cause they’d be branded lesbians.

These are the types of social constraints which only make things confusing for me. As I don’t know which of my feelings are “normal” or not. I’ve only met one friend (he’s straight) who didn’t have a problem hugging me or other guys.

I know, I don’t have to figure it all out before I’m 25. 😀

But it would be nice to sort out my feelings. When I see many of my friends getting married, or getting into relationships I’m realising that it won’t be so easy for me. Of course many people stay single until they’re 40’s like you said. But I’m not so worried about the single aspect as I am with the fact that I identify as being gay.

It may be quite an overstatement, also, to suggest that EVERYTIME a guy hugs another guy or shows feeling that they are IMMEDIATELY branded as gay complete WITH ALL the negative stereotypes. if we’re honest with ourselves, we’ll realize that many times we imagine these feelings and we generalize that they are happening when, in fact, they are not. I’m not saying that the negative stereotypes don’t exist; I’m trying to point out that ‘tunnel vision’ makes us see only the extremes and obscures the reality in between.

You mentioned that ALL of your friends are getting married. Is that really true or does it only seem that way? In my world, a lot of people do get married between high school and their early twenties but I know many, many people who remain single into their 30’s or 40’s. Anyway, give yourself a break from the time pressure. You’re young yet with lots of years likely ahead of you. You don’t need to have it all figured out by the time you’re 25!

(BTW: You might want to check the sidebar on the page for ‘most recently commented’…this would lead you to some current topics where people are discussing. I’m hoping that a few will notice that you’ve commented on this older topic and will respond to you here but, otherwise, come and find everybody in the more current topics.)

I also struggled with my feelings towards other guys during my teenage years. The annoying thing is that in our western society (English speaking countries) you can never talk about such feelings and taboos. So it only builds up and gets worse.

It’s funny how straight men can dress up in drag, imitate gay stereotypes and everyone applauds, laughs and has a good time. Yet if a man (any orientation) wants to embrace another guy, tends to show his feelings, etc they’re immediately branded gay and every negative stereotype that comes along with it.

That in a nutshell is why it has been very confusing for me growing up. I come from a European background, where both genders kiss, embrace, make comments about someone of the same-sex’s looks, and no one thinks twice about it. Yet in Australia where I’ve grown up, you were immediately branded a fag for not wanting to play rough with the other boys, if you wore anything slightly different in colour, style. If you weren’t as sexually promiscuous with the girls or if you hug a male friend.

All this has made me wonder about how my identity developed. All the stereotypes out there don’t fit me. I have two great parents and have always gotten along fine with my dad, I haven’t been abused and I’m not afraid of men or women. It can be hurting when heterosexuals tell you it’ll go away and brush off my worries. It was especially insulting when one of my friends I came out to, said he knew that all gays were abused and couldn’t believe I hadn’t been.

At the moment I dunno what to think. It’s hard making other’s understand it wasn’t some flippant choice I made. The feelings just came and grew, I could blame myself for giving in to them. Yet I didn’t know any better, how could I? It felt natural to like other guys. Right now, I’m 23, all my friends are getting married and I’m stuck with the prospect of being alone all my life.

One more thing that has troubled me, God has answered my prayers, I no longer lust and fantisize about other guys like I did, I also have a good self esteem and have purpose. Yet I don’t feel anything for girls, I can tell who’s attractive etc. But I have more of a tendancy to be with a guy. No it’s not about lustfully looking at a guy for sex. I just want a close friend, a companion.

With both sides of this issue so polarised, I dunno who to trust, there are extremes, judement and stereotypes from both sides. Personally I’ve only got God left, but I just wish so much that I knew what “normal” feelings were.