The reason I mentioned you was because I sensed you knew this topic very well and hoped that you would chime in precisely, as you have. Thanks for you comments. They help us all.

David Blakeslee

I think you are making a mistake when you say “Tim knows the research on married men who abuse children…is the pressure of their closeted life the thing that drives them to abuse?”

This assumes that married men who abuse children must be SSA and in the closet. This is not accurate.

Most men who abuse children have no interest whatsoever in adult men. Most abusers are family members or friends and select their victims based on availability. And we all know that boys are watched less closely than girls around grown men and are much more available.

But even for those who focus solely on boys, if they have interest in adults at all (those who are not fixated on children) it is in most cases women.

I think it is a mistake to confuse pedophile abuse (which does not seem have any correlation with SSA) and poor judgement and inappropriate behavior (such as flirting with legal 16 to 18 year old boys). Neither is desirable behavior, but they are not the same thing and should not be conflated.

http://www.americanthinker.com/comments.php?comments_id=6289

http://www.drudgereport.com/page.htm

Would this have happened if Edmund had not been identified?

David Blakeslee

1. The timing of the disclosure seems clearly for political impact.

2. The fact (I think) that a blog was manufactured to create the disclosure and a few hours later picked up by KOS suggests a strongly manipulated news release.

3. The fact that the media repeatedly conflates e-mails with text messages (the NYT did again this morning). The text messages are explicit and potentially criminal (but probably not); the e-mails are void of sexual content.

4. For a gay man who appears to have a sexual compulsion, Foley found a way to “play by the rules” in this situation.

5. Revelations today indicate his victim was around the age of 18 when the text messages occur.

Others may wish to argue this list or add to it, I just post it for consideration.

I would like to add that the FOLEY issue is a good opportunity to discuss the issue of the Closet. Tim knows the research on married men who abuse children…is the pressure of their closeted life the thing that drives them to abuse?

Perhaps an internal versus external locus of control discussion is helpful. Poor internal locus of control persons may add external locus of control values and identities to help control them. Poorly integrated values (such as heterosexuality, monogomy, etc) are the most likely to break down during periods of distress. Valuing heterosexuality (either in Foley’s comments in the past, or by being a man with SSA who decides to live heteroseuxally) while not acknowledging strong SSA to support systems around you places you in isolation when stressors increase.

I am not sure I have written accurately but what I am trying to say is it is not “the closet” so much as a combination of internal conflict, isolation and poor coping skills.

Coming out Gay is not the simple solution. Coming out Real to those who know you best and doing the difficult work of processing sensations through values and values through sensations allows for integration. I do much better as a person under stress when I have worked through the variety of issues related to that stress. I am much more impulsive and reactive when I have not.

I may chose an external locus of control model to help me with what I have not integrated yet; but it is more likely to fail me.

Just some thoughts.

David Blakeslee

I don’t have a problem with other blogs choosing to allow Marty to comment. He represents an egotistical extreme that doesn’t care what his supposed enemies really believe or do. That extreme personality type is central to the culture wars. By serving that role, Marty provides an opportunity for other commenters (conservatives in particular) to distance themselves from his sort of extreme.

After the scandal with predatory catholic preists (80% of whom were homosexual predators), I’ve often wondered how many of their teenage “victims” never bothered to come forward, because they didn’t consider themselves “abused”, and they went on to become happy young gay men, and members of Dignity and the Rainbow Sash.

How easily Foley could have chosen that same route…

Someone tell Melissa Fryrear

😉

Those who view orientation as maliable (especially during childhood formative years) may view molestation as something that could confuse sexual development and possible impact eventual orientation identity.

I think the argument is not illogical for early childhood molestation. I doubt it is true, but I have little to support my doubts other than guesswork.

But when discussing molestation of male adolescents, I find it a far more likely scenario that same-sex attracted boys are more available to male predators than boys who are not same-sex attracted (need I remind anyone that adolescent boys have sexual interests and sexual attractions?).

In Foley’s case, it seems that he’s making the two statments separately: 1) he was molested as an adolescent, and 2) he’s gay.

anon,

To answer your question, in DC 16 is legal. However, it seems that the internet predator laws (which Foley was heavily involve with writing) protect kids under 18.

But no one seems clear whether any actual crime occurred.

Yeah, it’s icky for a 52 year old man to be making passes at 16 year olds of either sex but it may not necessarily be illegal. We just don’t know yet.

But that really isn’t the point. Foley betrayed the trust of his position.

jim,

yeah it is work monitoring comments. Fortunately we have pretty responsible participants and we have quite a few of us doing it at XGW. And we’ve been lucky. That’s why we can allow comments to be posted without prior vetting. As best I know, Warren is doing it alone. Before you go that direction, think of the time committment.

It’s a tough call sometimes. It’s why I haven’t yet decided whether to allow comments on my web site. I see how beneficial they can be when moderated, as is done here and XGW, but it seems to be an awful lot of work.