Comments on: What does change mean? https://wthrockmorton.com/2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/ A [retired] college psychology professor's observations about public policy, mental health, sexual identity, and religious issues Tue, 01 Aug 2006 02:30:00 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.8.3 By: Throckmorton https://wthrockmorton.com/2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1017 Tue, 01 Aug 2006 02:30:00 +0000 https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1017 Michael: When someone who had no attractions to the OS acquires them, that may mean they have become bisexual and it is change. It may not be change from exclusively gay to exclusively straight but it is change and it does represent a certain fluidity to sexual attractions that indeed research has demonstrated for some. See the Kinnish et all study in the 2005 Archives of Sexual Behavior.

]]> By: Michael Bussee https://wthrockmorton.com/2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1016 Tue, 01 Aug 2006 02:26:00 +0000 https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1016 Dr. Throckmorton:

In the example you give, the guy would be considered bi-sexual — having attractions to both sexes. Why is this so hard for youto grasp? The general public doesn’t have all this trouble. Most folks are real clear on these distinctions:

Gay (or homosexual): having sexual attractions toward the same sex

Straight (or heterosexual): having sexual attractions towards the opposite sex

Bi-sexual: having BOTH.

It’s really pretty simple.

“Post” gay or “ex” gay just creates a semantic MESS. Let’s stop inventing terms to suit our prejudices and just SPEAK ENGLISH, OK?

]]> By: grantdale https://wthrockmorton.com/2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1015 Sun, 19 Feb 2006 17:59:00 +0000 https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1015 Spitzer also asked the wives of ex-gays and they reported marital satisfaction that was about average for married couples.

He did? Would you mind checking that?

I would also like to see critics of post gay people be less dismissive of their choices.

I presume you’re not talking about criticising someone for living as a heterosexual? (or even as celibate) I can’t think of any such criticism, or of any critic that happens to be anti-straight — even from those quite a fair way off mainstream.

I wish the same could be said in reverse, yourself included.

The criticism is about the vile way exgay people like Tim Wilkins describes people such as myself, and about the utterly misleading way that they present “change” or the rates of “change”.

Tim Wilkins’ site is full of all manner of rude and false nonsense, only one of which Boo mentioned.

Therefore: if he cannot be truthful about other people’s lives, why should he be taken on trust about himself?

But, suspending that, there is a great deal that has changed about Wilkins’ life: least of all that he is no longer an abused child of awful (heterosexual) parents.

His life story has some plausible alternate explanations that many therapists would at least ponder if dealing with him. None of those explanations, unfortunately, say anything about changing gay to straight.

]]> By: Boo https://wthrockmorton.com/2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1014 Thu, 16 Feb 2006 03:07:00 +0000 https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1014 “The longer I study this matter the less I am interested in the degree to which sexual attractions change.”

Perhaps there’s a new slogan in there you can popularize:

“Ex-gay: It’s not about changing sexual attractions!”

]]> By: Throckmorton https://wthrockmorton.com/2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1013 Thu, 16 Feb 2006 02:49:00 +0000 https://www.wthrockmorton.com//2006/02/14/what-does-change-mean/#comment-1013 I’ll say again that your post highlights the difficulty in measurement. Not all straights like oral sex; not all gay men do either, nor do all gay men engage in anal sex. Determining sexual attraction change via behavior is full of problems. The longer I study this matter the less I am interested in the degree to which sexual attractions change. People do not live by the hypothalamus alone but rather make life choices based on a collection of factors and desires, some of which seem consistent to the individual and some of which do not.

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