Michael said:

Gays are different and the same. Straights are different and the same. I think we have to be careful making generalizations about an entire group of people. Of course we are the same. We are human. Of course we are different. We are gay.

Being gay in a non-gay or even anti-gay culture is bound to create some differences in experience, attitude, beliefs, lifestyle etc. but these will vary from individual to individual.

What I am reacting to are group generalizations, negative sterotypes. I reject the implication that these “differences” make one group less valuable, less opposed to violence, less opposed to child abuse, less concerned with holiness, etc. than the other.

I agree with all of it except the last paragraph. I believe he is reacting to more than that. When someone uses a phrase like ‘gay lifestyle’, he takes offense and assumes they mean it as something negative. When I’ve spoken of a ‘gay identity’ or ‘identification with gay culture or sub-culture’, my terminology is strenuously rejected…and there’s the constant ‘I don’t know what you mean by ‘gay identity’ or ‘identifying with the gay culture’. I believe that to be bogus. In my gay hey-day we often joked that you could have your ‘gay card revoked’ if you didn’t like Barbra, Liza or Bette.
Years later, it was the likes of Donna Summer or comedienne Margaret Cho. Performers who are said to have a ‘large gay following’. Now, why is that? Are these performers gay? Are they attractive men? Yet there is something in each of them that touches a common thread of identification in large enough numbers to be recognized as a ‘large gay following’.

Jay touched on a love for the theatre, wit, camp, the non-sexual but close female relationship…while these may be generalizations, they are also very true and are hallmarks of the gay lifestyle. (Jack and Will were very different gay characters but it’s interesting that they both had the listed loves. Will appreciated theatre while Jack loved theatrics (especially if he was at the center); Will’s wit was often more intelligent than Jack’s but Jack’s had a touch more sting; Will could camp it up around other gays while Jack camped with every breath; Will had Grace but Jack had Karen.) Am I a ‘used to be gay’ who got sucked into a bad television show because it pandered to straight stereotypes of gays? If so, I joined a crowd of gays who also bought into it. The day of the final broadcast was a big enough deal that several of the gay bars were riveted to the final episode. Some said that there hadn’t been such a cultural bonding over non-sports TV since the days of the Dynasty nights. (True to gay humor and wit, one bar drew a huge crowd every week by showing Dynasty…they gave away free drinks whenever one of the ladies slapped the other.) This is part of ‘lifestyle’; responding to it is ‘identification’.

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I don’t have much to say re the ‘violence detour’. I see the reaction to Mary’s ‘stereotyping’ remarks but then I’m puzzled why there was no companion reaction to Jay’s ‘sterotyping’ remarks that gays were more sensitive and less violent. Why is proof and back-up demanded for Mary’s opinion but not for Jay’s?